Preparedness as a Retirement Plan
From TSP Forum here - http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=8886.0
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Preparedness as a Retirement Plan (Read 27771 times)
Note from Jack - I split this post off from Coldhavens orginal post about modern survival focus because it was so outstanding I felt it should have its own thread as a stand alone. One of the best conversation starters ever on TSPs Forum!
I don't mean to be so presumptious to think that I could as elegantly say what CH has said. There was something...I don't know...transcendent about that post. It just reverberates.However, I would like to add my reasons for following a preparedness philosophy in my life. Maybe someone new to this way of thinking may find motivation in it. The stereotypical motivations of fighting the NWO or other things like that are so emotion based as to not be sustainable. But having a goal is sustaining. Well, without further ado....
Preparedness as a Retirement Plan
The concept of retirement is a relatively new one. Not so long ago, when we were a more agrarian based society, few people ever retired. Their daily duties just changed. As we grew older, we would take over running the farm, and then we would maybe step back and let our kids do that. Maybe we would take over maintenance of the equipment or something little less physically demanding, but required experience. Maybe we would help out more inside the home. But flat out retirement to travel south or play golf all day was the domain of the ultra rich. Even then, most tycoons were still wheeling and dealing well into their 60’s and beyond.
Nowadays. with retirement plans tanking and pension funds bleeding out, we may find ourselves without the ability to retire once again. However, this time, we won’t have the farm to feed us and the multi-generational home to keep us occupied and close to our loved ones. If we’re very fortunate, we may be able to find a spot in a retirement home and sell our current homes to pay for it.
Me, I have a different plan. My plan depends on me getting prepared to take care of myself and my wife for as long as we are physically able. If my plan works, we’ll also be able to ‘retire’ early. That plan is preparedness.
When you think about it, if you can provide most of your own food, utilities, and medicine and your shelter is bought and paid for, how much money do you really need? Enough to pay the property taxes, run your vehicle, and take care of emergencies. Maybe you need some money for a bit of travel as well. But not as much money as two people working for more than 40 hours a week each generate.
It’s not hard to imagine a household income of around $100,000 a year or about $73,000 after taxes. (Remember, I'm in Canada. Our dollars are about 80% of the USD.) Now, we know a lot of people are going to have mortgage payments around $1400 a month, utilities of at least $400 a month, TV and Internet for another $200 a month, $500 for food, $400 for various insurances, $200 for gas for the vehicles…it goes on and on.
So just the cost of living consumes $3100 of your after-tax income. Yearly, that’s about half of your income. If you can pay off your home, produce half of your utilities, drop the fancy TV package and step down a notch on the Internet access (that’s a tough one for me) and produce half of your food, you cut that outlay to about $1100 dollars a month. At that point, one of you can effectively retire. Or, the two of you can work half as much.
So what do you do with the extra 20-30 hours a week? Do the soul-building things like work your garden, love your spouse, split some wood, read books, start a business, whatever! Now, you are working for you. And should everything go for a poop, you are completely prepared to live comfortably and well with little to no income.
I find the thought of retiring to my homestead around the age of 50 to be a much more motivating and positive thought, than to think of prepping to cope with worldwide disaster. Disaster may never come, but time always marches on.
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It is funny how commonality of preparation works,,, If you are prepared for a genuinely secure and strings-free retirement, you are more or less prepared for all but the worst SHTF scenarios.Yes! you get it! If you are prepared for the day-to-day disasters, you'll be prepared for larger scale disasters. That's something James Talmadge Stevens expounds upon. And Jack does too, of course! Oh, and me. And all the Mods.
Great post CdnGuy,
Thanks for the compliment!
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+1 Cdnguy!Wonderful! Glad to hear that you are headed in the right direction. I'm also glad to hear that you are truly diversifying your investments and not just putting it all in the financial paper market. Jack says it plainly - that is NOT diversifying. You've just bought different cuts of pork from the same pig. It's still all pig though.
I love this thread. So many people putting into words what got me started here. I looked around last fall when the economy was tanking and my retirement account was dwindling. I'm in my late 30's and figured out i dont want to work til i am in my 70's (which is what retirement will be when we get there). So we started doing the dave ramsey thing and as i looked at cutting expenses. I quickly figured out the more self sufficient you are, the less money you have going out. As i looked for podcasts on self sufficiency i came across tsp. I continue to be amazed by this forum and the show. I still put money in retirement that i wont be able to touch til i reach whatever arbitrary age the government says is 'retirement', but i am also stashing money elsewhere and making plans to slow down ('semi-retire if you will') before 50. Your discussion of weaning down what it takes to live is a conversation my wife and i had several months ago. We are blessed to live on 5 acres several miles from town, so we are starting alot of this already.
Again, thanks for bringing it here for discussion since reading about others thinking and doing the same thing makes it feel more doable.
One of the best things to happen to me recently was when the dog chewed through the satellite cable. Now I have found TSP and started my own blog. I don't think that would have happened sitting in front of the flickering-blue babysitter.
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I am glad to see that more people are going agrarian in one form or another. I thought I was the only throw back on this board for the longest time. I am not trying to insult or isolate but to emit happiness.
My situation is almost exactly what Cdnguy stated in the initial post. I have taken in the wife's parents who are both medically disabled (father is two year survivor of cancer and a 25 year survivor of a broken back) and mother in law is currently in the hospital getting back surgery. Why did we integrate/adopt her parents? Because we had seen how their lives had become sedentary and we had seen the repercussions of that with the great grandparents. Two years retired and in the dirt due to in-activity. That was not going to happen on my watch. So now we have live in babysitters and homestead executives that tend the little ones and mold the wooded ten acres in a legacy that will support all of us one day. Dad has progressed from suicide thru being sedentary after his first bout with cancer to teaching, creating, watching and growing my sons and our property (we think as a collective now) into something like a commune...
I do not want to work forever and be alone in the end. I want my children to learn in the best situation I can give them and maybe, just maybe, they will be able to take care of me while I create for their kids. I want to leave a means for freedom not an obligation to finish my debts. I want everything done: food, shelter, heat, electricity and education so that they can "opt in" on their terms and not popular societies' opinion of what should be the status quo. I want Independence for all of us.
As of this point I have nine people here (all family) that are pitching in and creating there own niches on the property. One of the rules is "do whatever you want, as long as it hurts no one and could help everyone". I have so much going on around here it gets mind boggling. I look around and I see two solar water heater projects, one earth oven in a test phase, two small gardens, one giant compost area, two ponds being built and I spotted a swale test over by the new apple trees and I have my animal projects. I just found out tonite about the water line being run to the back of the property. Apparently they want to make a campground/RV area with a community cook and relax area/building.
i just try to keep everyone focused on one or three goals so we don't waste time or money and keep it legal.
I think i will start a thread on this so as not to hijack. Where should I put it?
Chin up and shovel down...
Dave B
My situation is almost exactly what Cdnguy stated in the initial post. I have taken in the wife's parents who are both medically disabled (father is two year survivor of cancer and a 25 year survivor of a broken back) and mother in law is currently in the hospital getting back surgery. Why did we integrate/adopt her parents? Because we had seen how their lives had become sedentary and we had seen the repercussions of that with the great grandparents. Two years retired and in the dirt due to in-activity. That was not going to happen on my watch. So now we have live in babysitters and homestead executives that tend the little ones and mold the wooded ten acres in a legacy that will support all of us one day. Dad has progressed from suicide thru being sedentary after his first bout with cancer to teaching, creating, watching and growing my sons and our property (we think as a collective now) into something like a commune...
I do not want to work forever and be alone in the end. I want my children to learn in the best situation I can give them and maybe, just maybe, they will be able to take care of me while I create for their kids. I want to leave a means for freedom not an obligation to finish my debts. I want everything done: food, shelter, heat, electricity and education so that they can "opt in" on their terms and not popular societies' opinion of what should be the status quo. I want Independence for all of us.
As of this point I have nine people here (all family) that are pitching in and creating there own niches on the property. One of the rules is "do whatever you want, as long as it hurts no one and could help everyone". I have so much going on around here it gets mind boggling. I look around and I see two solar water heater projects, one earth oven in a test phase, two small gardens, one giant compost area, two ponds being built and I spotted a swale test over by the new apple trees and I have my animal projects. I just found out tonite about the water line being run to the back of the property. Apparently they want to make a campground/RV area with a community cook and relax area/building.
i just try to keep everyone focused on one or three goals so we don't waste time or money and keep it legal.
I think i will start a thread on this so as not to hijack. Where should I put it?
Chin up and shovel down...
Dave B
- Senior Survivalist
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The concept of preparedness as retirement is exactly the course I am trying to follow right now. It would be nice to be 38 again, but that was twenty years ago. Nineteen years ago I met my wife (who is now a mostly recovered ex-grasshopper), and ended up living in the 'burbs with my wife, stepkids, and mother-in-law. This was not my original plan, but I love the gal, so I lived in the suburbs, while being a nature loving ant at heart.
Now, we are cashing in all of our retirement savings accounts (she has income from a government pension, from 31 years as a probation officer) and using that money, and the proceeds from the sale of our current house, to pay off debt and to purchase our dream homestead which costs twice what our present home is worth. The new place is mostly self sufficient - wood heat, dual wells, septic, lots of wild game, and good garden and market farming potential. We will have a mortgage, a small electric bill (for now), and property taxes. If the economy rebounds (yeah, right) then all will be well and we will pay off the mortgage with our share of the prosperity. if (hyper?)inflation strikes then our profit from the sale of food, wood, and hay will increase while the mortgage remains constant and we will pay it off with inflated dollars. We will be able to survive without much of any outside electric supply. This will keep us secure and happy, and provide a valuable asset to leave the kids at the end of the road.
For our situation, the property has an excellent single wide home for my MIL to live in, about 200 feet from the main house. Assuming that my MIL (84 yrs old) will die before my wife and I, then in our decrepit years we can give free rent in the single-wide to a caretaker to do the physical chores, thus filling the role of the 'younger generation' in the earlier scenario of how family homesteads had different jobs for different ages, in order to help run the property.
I don't trust any other form of retirement. Stocks, cash, social security, certificates, bonds, IOUs, etc. are just PAPER. Lots of luck with that when the SHTF. Land, ammo, gold and silver metal, fuel, and food will be the new wealth. Now is the time to convert most monetary investments to real hard assets. As for the "tax authorities" taxing any bartering - fat chance. Without W2/1099 forms, receipts, a common form of exchange (currency), or bank records; we are on the honor system. I guess the tax man would have to be standing in back of the barn when a dozen eggs gets traded for some welding, etc. However, at that point in time I think the tax man may be quite busy himself bartering to feed his clan. I wonder how the 'tax man' will report such activities in an honor system?
Now, we are cashing in all of our retirement savings accounts (she has income from a government pension, from 31 years as a probation officer) and using that money, and the proceeds from the sale of our current house, to pay off debt and to purchase our dream homestead which costs twice what our present home is worth. The new place is mostly self sufficient - wood heat, dual wells, septic, lots of wild game, and good garden and market farming potential. We will have a mortgage, a small electric bill (for now), and property taxes. If the economy rebounds (yeah, right) then all will be well and we will pay off the mortgage with our share of the prosperity. if (hyper?)inflation strikes then our profit from the sale of food, wood, and hay will increase while the mortgage remains constant and we will pay it off with inflated dollars. We will be able to survive without much of any outside electric supply. This will keep us secure and happy, and provide a valuable asset to leave the kids at the end of the road.
For our situation, the property has an excellent single wide home for my MIL to live in, about 200 feet from the main house. Assuming that my MIL (84 yrs old) will die before my wife and I, then in our decrepit years we can give free rent in the single-wide to a caretaker to do the physical chores, thus filling the role of the 'younger generation' in the earlier scenario of how family homesteads had different jobs for different ages, in order to help run the property.
I don't trust any other form of retirement. Stocks, cash, social security, certificates, bonds, IOUs, etc. are just PAPER. Lots of luck with that when the SHTF. Land, ammo, gold and silver metal, fuel, and food will be the new wealth. Now is the time to convert most monetary investments to real hard assets. As for the "tax authorities" taxing any bartering - fat chance. Without W2/1099 forms, receipts, a common form of exchange (currency), or bank records; we are on the honor system. I guess the tax man would have to be standing in back of the barn when a dozen eggs gets traded for some welding, etc. However, at that point in time I think the tax man may be quite busy himself bartering to feed his clan. I wonder how the 'tax man' will report such activities in an honor system?
I do hope that the new home that costs twice as much won't burden you with twice the mortgage. Maybe do some research on rates and consider locking in longer, even if the rate is a bit higher than the best rate right now. I'd be willing to bet we'll see 18% again in the next few years. Just like the early 80's. Just something to think about.
The unfortunate thing about counting on inflation dollars, is that the inflation in income seriously lags on inflation in prices. Trying to survive that stretch is what knocks most people on their keister.
You went through the 80's. This isn't anything you don't know, I know that. But for those folks that weren't around, or don't remember, hopefully this benefits them.
The unfortunate thing about counting on inflation dollars, is that the inflation in income seriously lags on inflation in prices. Trying to survive that stretch is what knocks most people on their keister.
You went through the 80's. This isn't anything you don't know, I know that. But for those folks that weren't around, or don't remember, hopefully this benefits them.
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The mortgage will be more than we pay now, but the other costs of living will be less. We will be getting a 30 yr fixed mortgage, so we won't worry about a change interest rates. Yep, I did live through the 80's. In cleaning our current house for the move I ran across a 'mortgage rate book' from 1980/81. This was before PC's or the internet, so books with tables were used to estimate mortgages. The mortgage rates in that book STARTED at 16%.
We will work to pay off the new homestead ahead of schedule. We plan on being small time market farmers, will have 20 acres in hay, and we will have a 120 acre forest for firewood and timber sales. If inflation strikes then food costs will increase quickly, so we will rely on crop sales as one way to fill the gap. I have no problem with participating in the underground economy and/or bartering. We will be rid of virtually all consumer debt, so the mortgage and taxes will be the only bills. If society really collapses then the government will have a hard time collecting taxes since they will be too busy saving their collective asses.
Finally, there is the fact that I love the place we are buying. It is 144 acres with field and forest, a trout stream, 3 waterfalls, deer, turkey, etc. The three neighbors are a 150 acre farm that has been owned by the same family for 3 generations (they are staying), a 310 acre parcel with no house and a conservation easement that only allows one dwelling in the future, and a 570 acre state forest. Therefore, about 6 people live in 1,000 acres, but it is only 30 miles from an urban center. If an EMP hits, or hyperinflation shows up, then there is no place I'd rather be. The rest of the time it is heaven on Earth, assuming you can survive 3 months of some of the roughest winters in the U.S.
So there is my retirement plan - Divest of all 'assets' that I don't physically control; convert all monetary assets to a homestead and become self-sufficient in food, energy, and shelter; and be able to physically defend the property in the case of an EMP, roving hoards, or complete social collapse. It will also make a great and lasting inheritance for future generations.
We will work to pay off the new homestead ahead of schedule. We plan on being small time market farmers, will have 20 acres in hay, and we will have a 120 acre forest for firewood and timber sales. If inflation strikes then food costs will increase quickly, so we will rely on crop sales as one way to fill the gap. I have no problem with participating in the underground economy and/or bartering. We will be rid of virtually all consumer debt, so the mortgage and taxes will be the only bills. If society really collapses then the government will have a hard time collecting taxes since they will be too busy saving their collective asses.
Finally, there is the fact that I love the place we are buying. It is 144 acres with field and forest, a trout stream, 3 waterfalls, deer, turkey, etc. The three neighbors are a 150 acre farm that has been owned by the same family for 3 generations (they are staying), a 310 acre parcel with no house and a conservation easement that only allows one dwelling in the future, and a 570 acre state forest. Therefore, about 6 people live in 1,000 acres, but it is only 30 miles from an urban center. If an EMP hits, or hyperinflation shows up, then there is no place I'd rather be. The rest of the time it is heaven on Earth, assuming you can survive 3 months of some of the roughest winters in the U.S.
So there is my retirement plan - Divest of all 'assets' that I don't physically control; convert all monetary assets to a homestead and become self-sufficient in food, energy, and shelter; and be able to physically defend the property in the case of an EMP, roving hoards, or complete social collapse. It will also make a great and lasting inheritance for future generations.
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Thanks CdnGuy, Jack and everyone else that has been sharing their dreams and success stories.
We've been working toward this end as well. I have to admit to being a prepper for many years. However, having found thesurvivalpodcast.com I have been really ramping up. Jack has inspired us to fnally start DOING alot of the things that only made it to our "To Do List" previously. Thanks Jack!
I've gotten so excited about what we have been getting done and trying to follow in the example that has been set by a number of influences over the last year, I have started a website to begin documenting the projects I've been working on. This is motivational for me and my family but also hopefully will inspire many to get moving on their own projects.
When I started to listen to the podcast 6-8 months ago I couldn't believe that I was hearing all the things going on in my own head, coming off my IPOD... Only from the IPOD they were so much more organized. It was encouraging to hear a credible, rational voice telling me to get moving and that I'm not crazy!
We have been using the "preps toward retirment" plan for a year or so. We have a BOL and have gotten some fruit trees started, irrigation lines ran to where the new garden will be beginning next spring. We have our own well and septic, we are on grid power but that will be our only utility bill. I have a couple of solar panels already purchased but not yet installed but they're available if something goes wrong prior to formal install., also the beginnings of our battery bank, charger, etc.
My daughter is turning 17 in a week or so and I'm roughly the same age as Jack. We have a similar timeline on making a permanent move to our BOL shortly after our baby is squared away on schooling. Obviously, those expenses could slow us down a year or two but we will make the move in only a few short years.
We couldn't justify the expense of building a stick built home on our 10 acres at this point, it all had to be mortgage free or no deal! So we ended up with what has turned out to be an excellent home - 1997 Singlewide mobile. I had no experience with these homes and have so far been extremely happy with it. Cost $19,000 including the move of over 200 miles and being reset on our land. Now I know that aint free but it was what we could do paying cash. I have seen this age of homes going for MUCH cheaper since but I'm not going to cry over it. 2 bedrooms and 2 full baths with all the necessities, laundry and large kitchen, paid for!
We're on our way, one daughter and mortgage in the city stand between us and country living. Yes, I am well aware what this prized country living will mean - alot of hard work, I can't wait!!
If anyone is interested in seeing some of what we've gotten done and watching our place progress, check out the website -
www.preppernation.com
Keep up the good work everybody,
Prepper
We've been working toward this end as well. I have to admit to being a prepper for many years. However, having found thesurvivalpodcast.com I have been really ramping up. Jack has inspired us to fnally start DOING alot of the things that only made it to our "To Do List" previously. Thanks Jack!
I've gotten so excited about what we have been getting done and trying to follow in the example that has been set by a number of influences over the last year, I have started a website to begin documenting the projects I've been working on. This is motivational for me and my family but also hopefully will inspire many to get moving on their own projects.
When I started to listen to the podcast 6-8 months ago I couldn't believe that I was hearing all the things going on in my own head, coming off my IPOD... Only from the IPOD they were so much more organized. It was encouraging to hear a credible, rational voice telling me to get moving and that I'm not crazy!
We have been using the "preps toward retirment" plan for a year or so. We have a BOL and have gotten some fruit trees started, irrigation lines ran to where the new garden will be beginning next spring. We have our own well and septic, we are on grid power but that will be our only utility bill. I have a couple of solar panels already purchased but not yet installed but they're available if something goes wrong prior to formal install., also the beginnings of our battery bank, charger, etc.
My daughter is turning 17 in a week or so and I'm roughly the same age as Jack. We have a similar timeline on making a permanent move to our BOL shortly after our baby is squared away on schooling. Obviously, those expenses could slow us down a year or two but we will make the move in only a few short years.
We couldn't justify the expense of building a stick built home on our 10 acres at this point, it all had to be mortgage free or no deal! So we ended up with what has turned out to be an excellent home - 1997 Singlewide mobile. I had no experience with these homes and have so far been extremely happy with it. Cost $19,000 including the move of over 200 miles and being reset on our land. Now I know that aint free but it was what we could do paying cash. I have seen this age of homes going for MUCH cheaper since but I'm not going to cry over it. 2 bedrooms and 2 full baths with all the necessities, laundry and large kitchen, paid for!
We're on our way, one daughter and mortgage in the city stand between us and country living. Yes, I am well aware what this prized country living will mean - alot of hard work, I can't wait!!
If anyone is interested in seeing some of what we've gotten done and watching our place progress, check out the website -
www.preppernation.com
Keep up the good work everybody,
Prepper
Keep on preppin with - preppernation.com
preppernation:
Cool web site you have there.
Now, back to the topic at hand ...
Cool web site you have there.
Now, back to the topic at hand ...
You might be interested in the ten-book prepper novel series called 299 Days. I, like, wrote it and stuff. Prepper Press is publishing it. Seriously. Check out www.299Days.com .
"If you pissed away your time and energy watching football and herding the family to endless soccer games, well, sorry grasshopper." -- post by jasonthomas on TSP
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There are physical assets, and then there are paper assets. A piece of productive land, a wood stove, a few milk cows, a few head of beef cattle, a wood lot, a chicken house, hand tools, a water well, gold and silver coins, guns and ammunition, an orchard, and the like are physical assets; these assets have intrinsic value from the use to which they can be put. Social security, a pension, a 401(k) plan, a bank account, stocks and bonds, insurance policies, annuities, and the like, are paper assets, all of which depend upon the promises or obligations of others to give these assets value; they have no intrinsic value unless you plan to use them to start a fire.
To live through a period of economic collapse and survive, you are much better off to have real assets, and no debts, instead of paper assets or debts.
To live through a period of economic collapse and survive, you are much better off to have real assets, and no debts, instead of paper assets or debts.
There are physical assets, and then there are paper assets. A piece of productive land, a wood stove, a few milk cows, a few head of beef cattle, a wood lot, a chicken house, hand tools, a water well, gold and silver coins, guns and ammunition, an orchard, and the like are physical assets; these assets have intrinsic value from the use to which they can be put. Social security, a pension, a 401(k) plan, a bank account, stocks and bonds, insurance policies, annuities, and the like, are paper assets, all of which depend upon the promises or obligations of others to give these assets value; they have no intrinsic value unless you plan to use them to start a fire.Agreed. A bird in the hand is still worth at least two in the tree.
To live through a period of economic collapse and survive, you are much better off to have real assets, and no debts, instead of paper assets or debts.
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- Coldylocks
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Here is something to know. For some reason a big number with the IRS is 1,000. You can give a gift to someone up to 1,000 a year tax free. This is true on a piece of land being called a farm. If it produces more than 1,000 dollars worth of revenue then it is considered a farm, but then you are subject to taxes and such because of the sales. In order for them to tax you they would have to place an amount on what you have given to other people. These bartered items could be considered gifts, of which, the other person gave you a gift in return. They would have to have a provable itemized list of the things you gave each other as gifts in order to say you gave each other more than 1,000 dollars worth during the course of a year. When you are talking small money items like vegetables and fruits you would have to give a lot to each other, and they would have to be able to itemize each thing you gave...which of course they would not be able to do. If they did try to itemize what they can proove you can base it off the value you would get from a farmer's market which is considerably lower than grocery store prices.
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Coldhaven,
Not to trying to split hairs but you can gift practically as much as you want to someone "tax free".
Over $12,000/yr/recipient and your estate exemption is reduced by anything over $12,000 in that year. I could gift you $100,000 tommorrow (haha in theory of course) and neither one of us would owe a cent in tax. I'd think the reporting form is #741 or something like that where I report the excess of the $12,000 for future reckoning on my estate tax return.
Dish over $1,000,000 in excess of the exempt $12,000/tr/recipient cumulative and you would be in gift tax land but most of us won't ever have to worry about it.
On the rest- Technically all bartered value is supposed to be reported as income. Gifting with the expectation of receiving a gift in return isn't gifting, it is bartering. Not my opinion, unfortunately these are the tax regs. "Arms length" evaluation of gifts and a lot of other types of transactions are of interest to the IRS. The IRS really expects us to report this even if only a few dollars hahahahahahahaha.
My point is if the IRS is on you that argument won't hold water.
The other thing to consider is what are known as the hobby loss rules. They expect us to report all income from any side hobby like a gentleman's farming operation but then won't let us take a loss. We have to prove it is a true business in order to take losses in excess of income.
Yeah it is stacked.
Not to trying to split hairs but you can gift practically as much as you want to someone "tax free".
Over $12,000/yr/recipient and your estate exemption is reduced by anything over $12,000 in that year. I could gift you $100,000 tommorrow (haha in theory of course) and neither one of us would owe a cent in tax. I'd think the reporting form is #741 or something like that where I report the excess of the $12,000 for future reckoning on my estate tax return.
Dish over $1,000,000 in excess of the exempt $12,000/tr/recipient cumulative and you would be in gift tax land but most of us won't ever have to worry about it.
On the rest- Technically all bartered value is supposed to be reported as income. Gifting with the expectation of receiving a gift in return isn't gifting, it is bartering. Not my opinion, unfortunately these are the tax regs. "Arms length" evaluation of gifts and a lot of other types of transactions are of interest to the IRS. The IRS really expects us to report this even if only a few dollars hahahahahahahaha.
My point is if the IRS is on you that argument won't hold water.
The other thing to consider is what are known as the hobby loss rules. They expect us to report all income from any side hobby like a gentleman's farming operation but then won't let us take a loss. We have to prove it is a true business in order to take losses in excess of income.
Yeah it is stacked.
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Folks have been doing this for years, we started well over a decade ago with the "homestead retirement" plan.
It's not that you want likely need ANY money, it's that you'll need so much LESS money.
When you actually own everything you have, no mortgage no car payments, when you have an AE producing your power, when you are growing/raising most of your food, how much LESS money would you need?
Yes the people that run to the doc for every sniffle and can't do some simple research on their own are still, and/or have chronic medical conditions are still going to have to pay for health insurance. However once your actually LIVING this way, i.e, not just talking about it, you'll find that your health will improve GREATLY.
Fresh air, the TV off, plenty of homestead work, the great outdoors to exercise in, eating food fresh from your garden, clean water without all kinds of chemicals in it, less air pollution, etc. all will contribute to better health conditions.
It's a great way to live, we've been at it a decade now and I wouldn't move back to the suburbs for all the money in the world. And of course if something actually does happen, people are going to die en mass in the cities and suburbs. And if nothing ever does happen, we are living for much less and experiencing much more freedom than the average city dweller.
It's not that you want likely need ANY money, it's that you'll need so much LESS money.
When you actually own everything you have, no mortgage no car payments, when you have an AE producing your power, when you are growing/raising most of your food, how much LESS money would you need?
Yes the people that run to the doc for every sniffle and can't do some simple research on their own are still, and/or have chronic medical conditions are still going to have to pay for health insurance. However once your actually LIVING this way, i.e, not just talking about it, you'll find that your health will improve GREATLY.
Fresh air, the TV off, plenty of homestead work, the great outdoors to exercise in, eating food fresh from your garden, clean water without all kinds of chemicals in it, less air pollution, etc. all will contribute to better health conditions.
It's a great way to live, we've been at it a decade now and I wouldn't move back to the suburbs for all the money in the world. And of course if something actually does happen, people are going to die en mass in the cities and suburbs. And if nothing ever does happen, we are living for much less and experiencing much more freedom than the average city dweller.
- TSP Goat Wrangling Geezer. He is EVIL also.
- Global Moderator
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- Karma: 127
- I live in Texas. What country are you from?
Well, as of today, I am doing this for real. After 37 years, 2 months, 2 weeks and 3 days with the same company, as of 3:30pm CDT today, I am retired. Free at last, free at last....
The savings will be converted to real assets. Debts, history. I can devote all of my energy to working directly for my family and me. I feel powerful.
The folks on this forum have contributed hugely to my ability to do this at this time. Plus, of course, working towards the goal, and a great retirement deal from mycurrent former employer.
All I have learned here (homesteading, permaculture, emergency preps, etc.) provided the boost needed to get over the top. Thank you, to all that have helped.
The savings will be converted to real assets. Debts, history. I can devote all of my energy to working directly for my family and me. I feel powerful.
The folks on this forum have contributed hugely to my ability to do this at this time. Plus, of course, working towards the goal, and a great retirement deal from my
All I have learned here (homesteading, permaculture, emergency preps, etc.) provided the boost needed to get over the top. Thank you, to all that have helped.
"I went down Virginia, seekin' shelter from the storm.
Caught up in the fable, I watched the tower grow.
Five year plans and new deals, wrapped in golden chains.
And I wonder, still I wonder who'll stop the rain."
Caught up in the fable, I watched the tower grow.
Five year plans and new deals, wrapped in golden chains.
And I wonder, still I wonder who'll stop the rain."
...A quote from the book 'Mataroda' comes to mind:WWCD = What would Cedar do?
'To do more than your best is impossible, to do less is unthinkable'
- non semper erit aestas
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- Don't Give Up Your Keys
Congrats TexDaddy!
- TSP Goat Wrangling Geezer. He is EVIL also.
- Global Moderator
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- I live in Texas. What country are you from?
Congratulations,TXDaddy, when do you plan to move to the BOL?As soon as my wife will let us go. Progress little by little. At least, now I have only one boss.
Thanks Cohutt and monkeyboyf. It feels so good.
"I went down Virginia, seekin' shelter from the storm.
Caught up in the fable, I watched the tower grow.
Five year plans and new deals, wrapped in golden chains.
And I wonder, still I wonder who'll stop the rain."
Caught up in the fable, I watched the tower grow.
Five year plans and new deals, wrapped in golden chains.
And I wonder, still I wonder who'll stop the rain."
...A quote from the book 'Mataroda' comes to mind:WWCD = What would Cedar do?
'To do more than your best is impossible, to do less is unthinkable'
Wow, TexDaddy. Super cool. Good for you. Taking control of your life. You'll never regret this.
You might be interested in the ten-book prepper novel series called 299 Days. I, like, wrote it and stuff. Prepper Press is publishing it. Seriously. Check out www.299Days.com .
"If you pissed away your time and energy watching football and herding the family to endless soccer games, well, sorry grasshopper." -- post by jasonthomas on TSP
- Survivalist Mentor
- Posts: 800
- Karma: 57
Well, as of today, I am doing this for real. After 37 years, 2 months, 2 weeks and 3 days with the same company, as of 3:30pm CDT today, I am retired. Free at last, free at last....Absolutely awesome!
The savings will be converted to real assets. Debts, history. I can devote all of my energy to working directly for my family and me. I feel powerful.
The folks on this forum have contributed hugely to my ability to do this at this time. Plus, of course, working towards the goal, and a great retirement deal from mycurrentformer employer.
All I have learned here (homesteading, permaculture, emergency preps, etc.) provided the boost needed to get over the top. Thank you, to all that have helped.
I propose a TSP toast- to TexDaddy- long life now made longer with new freedom! Cheers!
[should we make this a tradition when anyone of us "pulls the plug"?]
"What kind of recovery is this? We don't know, but if it continues much longer we'll all be unemployed."-Bill Bonner
"The budget should be balanced, the treasury should be refilled and the pubic debt should be reduced. The arrogance of public officialdom should be tempered and controlled. And the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed, lest we become bankrupt. - Cicero, 63 B.C.
2 Timothy 2:2 The things which you have heard from me in the presence of many witnesses, entrust these to faithful men who will be able to teach others also.
"The budget should be balanced, the treasury should be refilled and the pubic debt should be reduced. The arrogance of public officialdom should be tempered and controlled. And the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed, lest we become bankrupt. - Cicero, 63 B.C.
2 Timothy 2:2 The things which you have heard from me in the presence of many witnesses, entrust these to faithful men who will be able to teach others also.
- Survivor
- Posts: 178
- Karma: 19
Retirement planning was pretty much what got me into survivalism in the first place. I realized in college that I really had zero desire to work for someone else 40 hours a week for 40 years of my life. The two ways out that I came up with were to either get a whole lot of money somehow, or not need a whole lot of money. I don't have any wealthy relatives to leave me fortunes, so I went with the latter plan.
I found a piece of land shortly before I graduated, and bought it with the bit of money I did have saved up (I'd kept that money in hand and gotten student loans, rather than pay for school out of pocket). After I graduated, I found a job that paid well (bartending), and started saving money. The first year, I paid off all my student loans. The two years after that, all my money went into a shoe box to pay for building my house. This spring I decided I had enough put away, quit the job, and moved up to the property to start building. I'm now about two months away from having the house finished to the building inspector's eye (hooray first-time homebuyer tax credit!). Then this winter I'll be going back to the city for another job, because I need to save up more to put in my alt power system (I was able to put in the well, septic, and house, but can't swing the power yet - and I have zero interest in getting a loan for it).
In a couple more years like this, I hope to have my house all finished, the greenhouse up and running, a nice workshop put up, and be able to sustain myself through my hobbies. It's easy to live beneath the IRS' standard deduction when you have no power bill, water bill, sewer bill, car payment, or mortgage. I can live for myself and pursue things I find interesting, rather than spend my whole life making money for someone else. I don't know why more people don't do the same thing...
I found a piece of land shortly before I graduated, and bought it with the bit of money I did have saved up (I'd kept that money in hand and gotten student loans, rather than pay for school out of pocket). After I graduated, I found a job that paid well (bartending), and started saving money. The first year, I paid off all my student loans. The two years after that, all my money went into a shoe box to pay for building my house. This spring I decided I had enough put away, quit the job, and moved up to the property to start building. I'm now about two months away from having the house finished to the building inspector's eye (hooray first-time homebuyer tax credit!). Then this winter I'll be going back to the city for another job, because I need to save up more to put in my alt power system (I was able to put in the well, septic, and house, but can't swing the power yet - and I have zero interest in getting a loan for it).
In a couple more years like this, I hope to have my house all finished, the greenhouse up and running, a nice workshop put up, and be able to sustain myself through my hobbies. It's easy to live beneath the IRS' standard deduction when you have no power bill, water bill, sewer bill, car payment, or mortgage. I can live for myself and pursue things I find interesting, rather than spend my whole life making money for someone else. I don't know why more people don't do the same thing...
Forgotten Weapons - Your source for rare, exotic, and prototype firearms.
Bad times came and bad times went, and left us here alive
Desert folks have histories of learning to survive.
The troubles took the cities, and the rich farmlands beside
But they skipped our land as barren waste, so here we all abide.
-- Leslie Fish, "Route 40"
Bad times came and bad times went, and left us here alive
Desert folks have histories of learning to survive.
The troubles took the cities, and the rich farmlands beside
But they skipped our land as barren waste, so here we all abide.
-- Leslie Fish, "Route 40"
- TSP Goat Wrangling Geezer. He is EVIL also.
- Global Moderator
- Survival Veteran
- Posts: 9709
- Karma: 127
- I live in Texas. What country are you from?
I don't know why more people don't do the same thing...Way to go. The reason is, we do not believe we can. Plus, we thought we needed more.
Thanks to y'all also, Heavy G and dudekrtr. I like making the toast a TSP tradition. Great idea, dudekrtr. +1
"I went down Virginia, seekin' shelter from the storm.
Caught up in the fable, I watched the tower grow.
Five year plans and new deals, wrapped in golden chains.
And I wonder, still I wonder who'll stop the rain."
Caught up in the fable, I watched the tower grow.
Five year plans and new deals, wrapped in golden chains.
And I wonder, still I wonder who'll stop the rain."
...A quote from the book 'Mataroda' comes to mind:WWCD = What would Cedar do?
'To do more than your best is impossible, to do less is unthinkable'
Well, as of today, I am doing this for real. After 37 years, 2 months, 2 weeks and 3 days with the same company, as of 3:30pm CDT today, I am retired. Free at last, free at last....Very glad and encouraged to read this! Thanks TexDaddy!
The savings will be converted to real assets. Debts, history. I can devote all of my energy to working directly for my family and me. I feel powerful.
The folks on this forum have contributed hugely to my ability to do this at this time. Plus, of course, working towards the goal, and a great retirement deal from mycurrentformer employer.
All I have learned here (homesteading, permaculture, emergency preps, etc.) provided the boost needed to get over the top. Thank you, to all that have helped.
Beyond Surviving, On To Thriving!
CanadaPrepared.com
CanadaPrepared.com
I can live for myself and pursue things I find interesting, rather than spend my whole life making money for someone else. I don't know why more people don't do the same thing...Honestly, because most of us don't think of it. We get the "get a good job" mantra pushed on us. Once we are told to look for a job, we stop looking for anything else.
Does my heart good to hear about a younger person doing this. I assume you are younger - I could be wrong. It's all about the mindset isn't it?
Beyond Surviving, On To Thriving!
CanadaPrepared.com
CanadaPrepared.com
- Senior Survivalist
- Posts: 245
- Karma: 8
Congrats TexDaddy! I agree about making the toast a tradition as one of us is able to pull the plug
Brew status: 6 gal Dandelion Wine in secondary
10 gal Cream Ale in secondary
5 gal Hopped Honey Kolsch in Keg
"Everything that Richard Nixon did to me, for which he faced impeachment and prosecution, which led to his resignation, is now legal under the Patriot Act, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, and the National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA)." Daniel Ellsberg
10 gal Cream Ale in secondary
5 gal Hopped Honey Kolsch in Keg
"Everything that Richard Nixon did to me, for which he faced impeachment and prosecution, which led to his resignation, is now legal under the Patriot Act, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, and the National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA)." Daniel Ellsberg
- Senior Survivalist
- Posts: 232
- Karma: 12
Congratulations to those with freedom.
I think, CdnGuy is right. We are pushed from day one to excel. To many, excelling means good grades, college, great paying job, nice house, new cars, etc. I think one of the biggest this we can do for our children is to help them realize that this is not the only path to happiness and may not lead to happiness at all. I don't think schools teach the ability or desire to learn. It is my biggest wish that my girls have the desire to learn, to seek things out for themselves. I feel this will lead to being able to see their path to happiness, no matter what it might be.
I think, CdnGuy is right. We are pushed from day one to excel. To many, excelling means good grades, college, great paying job, nice house, new cars, etc. I think one of the biggest this we can do for our children is to help them realize that this is not the only path to happiness and may not lead to happiness at all. I don't think schools teach the ability or desire to learn. It is my biggest wish that my girls have the desire to learn, to seek things out for themselves. I feel this will lead to being able to see their path to happiness, no matter what it might be.
EmmaPeel
mom to two girls (16 & 12)
married nearly 23 years, gluten-free for over 11 years
My Life=Chaos Management
mom to two girls (16 & 12)
married nearly 23 years, gluten-free for over 11 years
My Life=Chaos Management
- TSP Goat Wrangling Geezer. He is EVIL also.
- Global Moderator
- Survival Veteran
- Posts: 9709
- Karma: 127
- I live in Texas. What country are you from?
Congratulations, TexDaddy... hope we can go to the range this month as a mini-celebration!I am looking forward to it. PM me when you are ready to go!
"I went down Virginia, seekin' shelter from the storm.
Caught up in the fable, I watched the tower grow.
Five year plans and new deals, wrapped in golden chains.
And I wonder, still I wonder who'll stop the rain."
Caught up in the fable, I watched the tower grow.
Five year plans and new deals, wrapped in golden chains.
And I wonder, still I wonder who'll stop the rain."
...A quote from the book 'Mataroda' comes to mind:WWCD = What would Cedar do?
'To do more than your best is impossible, to do less is unthinkable'
- Prepper
- Posts: 44
- Karma: 1
Retirement planning was pretty much what got me into survivalism in the first place. I realized in college that I really had zero desire to work for someone else 40 hours a week for 40 years of my life. The two ways out that I came up with were to either get a whole lot of money somehow, or not need a whole lot of money. I don't have any wealthy relatives to leave me fortunes, so I went with the latter plan.The steps you've taken seem similar to the ones I'm about to...
I found a piece of land shortly before I graduated, and bought it with the bit of money I did have saved up (I'd kept that money in hand and gotten student loans, rather than pay for school out of pocket). After I graduated, I found a job that paid well (bartending), and started saving money. The first year, I paid off all my student loans. The two years after that, all my money went into a shoe box to pay for building my house. This spring I decided I had enough put away, quit the job, and moved up to the property to start building. I'm now about two months away from having the house finished to the building inspector's eye (hooray first-time homebuyer tax credit!). Then this winter I'll be going back to the city for another job, because I need to save up more to put in my alt power system (I was able to put in the well, septic, and house, but can't swing the power yet - and I have zero interest in getting a loan for it).
In a couple more years like this, I hope to have my house all finished, the greenhouse up and running, a nice workshop put up, and be able to sustain myself through my hobbies. It's easy to live beneath the IRS' standard deduction when you have no power bill, water bill, sewer bill, car payment, or mortgage. I can live for myself and pursue things I find interesting, rather than spend my whole life making money for someone else. I don't know why more people don't do the same thing...
Have you documented your journey in excessive detail anywhere?
We're on the verge of this adventure, and I'm trying to take in as much info as I can before the plunge.
As a family of 6, there's a lot to consider.
- Survivor
- Posts: 178
- Karma: 19
Sorry - the only record out there is Joel's blog , which is far from comprehensive. I'd be happy to answer any particular questions you might have, though (either here or via PM).
Forgotten Weapons - Your source for rare, exotic, and prototype firearms.
Bad times came and bad times went, and left us here alive
Desert folks have histories of learning to survive.
The troubles took the cities, and the rich farmlands beside
But they skipped our land as barren waste, so here we all abide.
-- Leslie Fish, "Route 40"
Bad times came and bad times went, and left us here alive
Desert folks have histories of learning to survive.
The troubles took the cities, and the rich farmlands beside
But they skipped our land as barren waste, so here we all abide.
-- Leslie Fish, "Route 40"
- Prepper
- Posts: 44
- Karma: 1
I really don't have any specific questions per se, but rather am looking for a wide spectrum analysis that might bring up any issues I haven't thought about; things that worked, things that didn't, things that came up unexpectedly...
In my personal situation, it began with a time / money logic loop that I had been stuck in, resulting in me spinning my wheels in terms of progress toward the end goal. The way out of it (so far) has been to say "to Hell with money" and instead free up the time to take the necessary steps forward. Now I'm at a stage where I'm committed to leap (leave the metropolitan city area, cut the mortgage in half, and work on personal projects and maybe do some remote freelance to pay the bills). But before I leap, I'm taking a look to asses the situation to make sure I land right where I'm supposed to...
... if that made any sense.
I guess the short way of saying it is; I'm just trying to absorb as much data as possible before locking in the escape plan.
In my personal situation, it began with a time / money logic loop that I had been stuck in, resulting in me spinning my wheels in terms of progress toward the end goal. The way out of it (so far) has been to say "to Hell with money" and instead free up the time to take the necessary steps forward. Now I'm at a stage where I'm committed to leap (leave the metropolitan city area, cut the mortgage in half, and work on personal projects and maybe do some remote freelance to pay the bills). But before I leap, I'm taking a look to asses the situation to make sure I land right where I'm supposed to...
... if that made any sense.
I guess the short way of saying it is; I'm just trying to absorb as much data as possible before locking in the escape plan.
Page 3
- Survivor
- Posts: 178
- Karma: 19
Makes perfect sense to me. Taking that leap is freakin' scary!
I would suggest that you take whatever time and cost estimates you've come up with, and double them. If you are good at estimating such things, then still add 50%. Unexpected expenses will always come up. A big one for me was finding a couple huge car-sized rocks in my excavation, and having to pay for a jackhammer backhoe to remove them. Also, it will take you much longer to do things than it "should". All sorts of things will take time away from your building, like weather preventing you from working, or needing to take time to help a neighbor out with their projects.
I've done pretty well with my budget, only being about 10% over at this point (although my whole house structure was a fixed cost, which made budgeting easier). I haven't been so lucky on time, though. I'm currently about two months behind where I had expected to be.
I would advise you not to make the leap until you have the savings built up to make some serious progress on building. You might feel like you're going stir-crazy in the city "just" saving up money, but better to do that for a while than to get a house half built and run out of money.
Finally, of course, have plans B, C, and D. Figure out what you will do when your building savings run out, because they eventually will.
I would suggest that you take whatever time and cost estimates you've come up with, and double them. If you are good at estimating such things, then still add 50%. Unexpected expenses will always come up. A big one for me was finding a couple huge car-sized rocks in my excavation, and having to pay for a jackhammer backhoe to remove them. Also, it will take you much longer to do things than it "should". All sorts of things will take time away from your building, like weather preventing you from working, or needing to take time to help a neighbor out with their projects.
I've done pretty well with my budget, only being about 10% over at this point (although my whole house structure was a fixed cost, which made budgeting easier). I haven't been so lucky on time, though. I'm currently about two months behind where I had expected to be.
I would advise you not to make the leap until you have the savings built up to make some serious progress on building. You might feel like you're going stir-crazy in the city "just" saving up money, but better to do that for a while than to get a house half built and run out of money.
Finally, of course, have plans B, C, and D. Figure out what you will do when your building savings run out, because they eventually will.
Forgotten Weapons - Your source for rare, exotic, and prototype firearms.
Bad times came and bad times went, and left us here alive
Desert folks have histories of learning to survive.
The troubles took the cities, and the rich farmlands beside
But they skipped our land as barren waste, so here we all abide.
-- Leslie Fish, "Route 40"
Bad times came and bad times went, and left us here alive
Desert folks have histories of learning to survive.
The troubles took the cities, and the rich farmlands beside
But they skipped our land as barren waste, so here we all abide.
-- Leslie Fish, "Route 40"
- Fledgling Prepper
- Posts: 4
- Karma: 0
I could go on and on and sound like the crusty old man. Yet I'm only 37. Has the world really changed that much so quick?Don't sweat it. One does not have to be old to think with wisdom. ...and once you start its kind of like a cloud burst.
You said all the things I've been thinking for 2 years (I'm 47 now). I'm a ways from getting it done but I get closer every day. I chucked at your "If everything takes a poop..." terminoligy. I just hope I get pretty close before "everything takes a poop."
Thanks again.
-NetRanger
"...the right of the people to keep and bear arms SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED." - The Constitution For The United States
- Prepper
- Posts: 31
- Karma: 0
When I was your age... I never looked far enough ahead to think beyond my retirement. I guess it's why I hope others consider your post. So, I'm retired. I'm doing OK, but I've been serious about self-reliance & preparedness since my early 20's. I can live cheaper, feel more confident, and have most of what I want because of that. However, when you get older, you'll find that a labor-intensive life-style might be more than some can handle, especially if you're not accustomed to it. This forum is a good source of knowledge and direction. I'm glad that so many of you have chosen a path apart from the other "Sheeple" we live among. Enjoyed your post.
- Prepper
- Posts: 15
- Karma: 0
This is one of my favorite threads. Really inspiring and exactly what I had been thinking for some time right before I began listening to the TSP. It's really cool not to be alone out there in this.
I turn 31 in May. I am living in my first house, my BOL, out in the Shenandoah. It's awesome here, but still a little close to D.C. for my liking. Anyway, it had always been my desire to get it right the first time around on purchasing a house, you know, buying a home that I (we actually, as I have a wife and two kiddos) could grow in and live in for the rest of our life. Lucky for me, we found our house and my wife and I have grown to love it, even as we fix it up. Also lucky for me, I found the TSP which has provided lots of direction and ideas for moving forward and turning this place into a homestead.
I am presently watching my parents, who I love, are now retired, and in their late 60s, drown in debt because they refuse to abandon the entitlement lifestyle. It is sad to watch, but providing a clear yet unfortunate glimpse into what happens when you let living on credit consume you.
The sad upshot of all this is that had my parents kept their first house--an old farm house on an acre or two--it would have been paid for long ago, could pay cash for all their toys and wants, and likely not be on the verge of bankrupcy.
I turn 31 in May. I am living in my first house, my BOL, out in the Shenandoah. It's awesome here, but still a little close to D.C. for my liking. Anyway, it had always been my desire to get it right the first time around on purchasing a house, you know, buying a home that I (we actually, as I have a wife and two kiddos) could grow in and live in for the rest of our life. Lucky for me, we found our house and my wife and I have grown to love it, even as we fix it up. Also lucky for me, I found the TSP which has provided lots of direction and ideas for moving forward and turning this place into a homestead.
I am presently watching my parents, who I love, are now retired, and in their late 60s, drown in debt because they refuse to abandon the entitlement lifestyle. It is sad to watch, but providing a clear yet unfortunate glimpse into what happens when you let living on credit consume you.
The sad upshot of all this is that had my parents kept their first house--an old farm house on an acre or two--it would have been paid for long ago, could pay cash for all their toys and wants, and likely not be on the verge of bankrupcy.
- Survivalist Mentor
- Posts: 918
- Karma: 18
Quote
I am presently watching my parents, who I love, are now retired, and in their late 60s, drown in debt because they refuse to abandon the entitlement lifestyle. It is sad to watch, but providing a clear yet unfortunate glimpse into what happens when you let living on credit consume you.Oh man, I'm in pretty much EXACTLY the same situation as you. I don't know about your parents, but with mine it's not an income problem, it a spending problem.
The sad upshot of all this is that had my parents kept their first house--an old farm house on an acre or two--it would have been paid for long ago, could pay cash for all their toys and wants, and likely not be on the verge of bankrupcy.
I'm hoping that in 5-10 years I can buy a house and rent to my parents at a low rate so at least when they're too old to work they won't have to worry about making rent.
My in-laws on the otherhand are the exact opposite. My father-in-law was forced to go on a disability pension and only makes around 600 a month and my mother-in-law only works a part time minimum wage job, yet they have a great standard of living!
The reason is that they paid off their house early and never got into debt.
Thanks to this they can live very nicely in a semi-retirement manner with little income.
Freedom is the right of all sentient beings.- Optimus Prime
- Prepper
- Posts: 15
- Karma: 0
"but with mine it's not an income problem, it a spending problem." --Cool Blue
Yes, that's exactly what it is with my parents. I think it has to do with the sense of entitlement that they grew up with: "I've worked hard all my life. I deserve this. I don't really want much in this life. I just want a few luxuries like normal people, etc." And numerous other rationalizations. This past week I told my mom, politely but stepping on her toes a bit, that they can no longer afford to live this way. They are no longer at the point in life where they can assume they can just pay it off later.
The other side of it is that, like many others in their shoes, they don't want to believe that the party is (or even could be) over and that the day of financial reckoning is coming nigh. I'd like to help them, but I know it's not realistic. Being the youngest, I can only lead by example and let them know that it is cancer to add debt on top of debt every year and tell them how great it is to pay off debt.
That said, my parents have always been generous to me. I want to help them as much as possible, but they just don't want to listen when I tell them not to buy me stuff on their credit card--repeatedly. I just shake my head, thank them and pray.
Yes, that's exactly what it is with my parents. I think it has to do with the sense of entitlement that they grew up with: "I've worked hard all my life. I deserve this. I don't really want much in this life. I just want a few luxuries like normal people, etc." And numerous other rationalizations. This past week I told my mom, politely but stepping on her toes a bit, that they can no longer afford to live this way. They are no longer at the point in life where they can assume they can just pay it off later.
The other side of it is that, like many others in their shoes, they don't want to believe that the party is (or even could be) over and that the day of financial reckoning is coming nigh. I'd like to help them, but I know it's not realistic. Being the youngest, I can only lead by example and let them know that it is cancer to add debt on top of debt every year and tell them how great it is to pay off debt.
That said, my parents have always been generous to me. I want to help them as much as possible, but they just don't want to listen when I tell them not to buy me stuff on their credit card--repeatedly. I just shake my head, thank them and pray.
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I have a 10 year plan. My warehouse/investment property will be paid off and throwing off income. My retirement accounts should be well into the mid six figures. Hopefully the house will have enough equity to pay for the house on the BOL.
I have re-evaluated my life. The desire to become self sufficient is over whelming.
The only thing that concerns me is the chronic heatlth problems (diabetes, etcc...)
I have considered a move to Canada as a health insurance backup plan...
I have re-evaluated my life. The desire to become self sufficient is over whelming.
The only thing that concerns me is the chronic heatlth problems (diabetes, etcc...)
I have considered a move to Canada as a health insurance backup plan...
- Survivalist Mentor
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I have a 10 year plan. My warehouse/investment property will be paid off and throwing off income. My retirement accounts should be well into the mid six figures. Hopefully the house will have enough equity to pay for the house on the BOL.I'm sure once you achieve your goal your stress in life will decrease and your health will benefit.
I have re-evaluated my life. The desire to become self sufficient is over whelming.
The only thing that concerns me is the chronic heatlth problems (diabetes, etcc...)
I have considered a move to Canada as a health insurance backup plan...
Canada could use more people with common sense like preppers but be warned that although we give out free needles to junkies, diabetics have to pay for them in Canada.
Freedom is the right of all sentient beings.- Optimus Prime
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With the economic collapse of the USA propelled by the progressive political machine and fueled by massive debt, I have come to the conclusion that most Americans in their late 40's and up can't experience the type of retirement our parents had.
As I sit and contemplate my retirement fate as a 50 year old man, I realize that the retirement of the greatest generation, the silent generation, and even the one enjoyed by the first boomers is difficult at best to have; and more realistically it is unobtainable. So I am on a quest to find a way to enjoy my “golden years" to optimize the balance of my years of life to enjoy my family and create a true balance in my life. In doing this I hope to create a resource and reference guide for people like me and for the generations to come.
Let’s face it; social security is anything but secure. Pensions are virtually non-existent and my 401k has had more gains and losses than Oprah Winfrey. So I am seeking a way to create a lifestyle that will allow me and my wife to live a full and rewarding life with some self-reliance, until we leave this wonderful world for our next adventure.
The only way (un)social security can continue is from revenue from a national health care program or maybe cap & trade. Which is another step towards losing our freedoms. If you are 55 or less I feel you must prepare and develop self reliant skills and relationships because the money you have paid into this ponzy scheme is lost.
I have been researching this "new" lifestyle for a while and I have got my wife on board. 1st we are working to have no debt, 2nd we are learning the storing & preserving of food, 3rd getting out of our rural condo and into a homestead and we are voting for our future at every election at every level. This is a scary time for pre-retiree's.
As I sit and contemplate my retirement fate as a 50 year old man, I realize that the retirement of the greatest generation, the silent generation, and even the one enjoyed by the first boomers is difficult at best to have; and more realistically it is unobtainable. So I am on a quest to find a way to enjoy my “golden years" to optimize the balance of my years of life to enjoy my family and create a true balance in my life. In doing this I hope to create a resource and reference guide for people like me and for the generations to come.
Let’s face it; social security is anything but secure. Pensions are virtually non-existent and my 401k has had more gains and losses than Oprah Winfrey. So I am seeking a way to create a lifestyle that will allow me and my wife to live a full and rewarding life with some self-reliance, until we leave this wonderful world for our next adventure.
The only way (un)social security can continue is from revenue from a national health care program or maybe cap & trade. Which is another step towards losing our freedoms. If you are 55 or less I feel you must prepare and develop self reliant skills and relationships because the money you have paid into this ponzy scheme is lost.
I have been researching this "new" lifestyle for a while and I have got my wife on board. 1st we are working to have no debt, 2nd we are learning the storing & preserving of food, 3rd getting out of our rural condo and into a homestead and we are voting for our future at every election at every level. This is a scary time for pre-retiree's.
Life is made up of moments of contact no more. Take time to prepare so those moments of contact won't be lost.
Preppers Survive, Survivors Prep!!
http://www.myhomesteadgarden.com/
Preppers Survive, Survivors Prep!!
http://www.myhomesteadgarden.com/
- Prepper
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My goal in ten years is to generate at least half of my energy needs, 80% of my food, and be 100% mortgage free.
I find work enjoyable, when not accompanied with financial hardships. I could see working until my final day on earth, because I want to work.
My parents got married shortly after Korean War, lived in a garage apartment with nothing but hand me down furniture.
55 years later, they are worth a mint, though never living much above middle class means until the last ten years, and even then with an eye on the ball.
It is strange to see my parents in this economy. Aging and a bit scared! They still work everyday when they don't have too and they are both pushing 80 years old.
It will take this Great recession to shake Americans to our core and reboot the Depression era financial values of our parents and grand parents.
I have faith that even in this culture of "I wants" and easy debt, there are many that will succeed. It is a valuable lesson for children to see their parents sinking under the stress of debt from hell.
I have been too priveledged and could have and should have done better by now, but I'm better off than many.
I don't believe we are headed into the abyss, but do feel like I've being stewed in a pot of steadily warming water. This slow boil effect will eventually mean much higher taxes to cover entitlements (Medicare, Social Security).
The savers and preppers have always adjust and finsh ahead of the spenders. This has been the case in every uncertain period of US History.
I find work enjoyable, when not accompanied with financial hardships. I could see working until my final day on earth, because I want to work.
My parents got married shortly after Korean War, lived in a garage apartment with nothing but hand me down furniture.
55 years later, they are worth a mint, though never living much above middle class means until the last ten years, and even then with an eye on the ball.
It is strange to see my parents in this economy. Aging and a bit scared! They still work everyday when they don't have too and they are both pushing 80 years old.
It will take this Great recession to shake Americans to our core and reboot the Depression era financial values of our parents and grand parents.
I have faith that even in this culture of "I wants" and easy debt, there are many that will succeed. It is a valuable lesson for children to see their parents sinking under the stress of debt from hell.
I have been too priveledged and could have and should have done better by now, but I'm better off than many.
I don't believe we are headed into the abyss, but do feel like I've being stewed in a pot of steadily warming water. This slow boil effect will eventually mean much higher taxes to cover entitlements (Medicare, Social Security).
The savers and preppers have always adjust and finsh ahead of the spenders. This has been the case in every uncertain period of US History.
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- This is our dog Bailey. Ruffed grouse beware!
My wife and I turn 30 this spring and we close on our new 2.8 acre homestead on April 2. I believe we can have our new house producing for us almost completely, and have our mortgage payed off by the time we are 45. I love this topic of early retirement from "society's norms". It has been difficult to convince my wife that this is attainable but I think once she has seen the result of our "profits" from having our house provide for US, she will be completely on board. I have been working for someone else for 15 years, and have managed to compile debt in my early 20's that we are still trying to pay off. In this 15 year period I have almost nothing to show for my debt. We are not in far, but any debt is TOO much for me. Anyway I'm rambling, but I can see the light at the end of the tunnel and I'm so excited I had to tell someone.
- Prepper
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Social Security will always be there in some form, the problem is the value of that dollar, but then again it is indexed to inflation.
Former Fed Chairman Paul Volker has floated the idea essentially they would add one month each year to the "retirement" age by two years and systematically over a peroid of 10-15 years would stabelize the SS system without raising taxes.
Medicare is the big elephant in the room. Social Security is a pittance IMHO.
People going in the direction of self sufficiency and are heavy savers and preppers will largely be unaffected.
Former Fed Chairman Paul Volker has floated the idea essentially they would add one month each year to the "retirement" age by two years and systematically over a peroid of 10-15 years would stabelize the SS system without raising taxes.
Medicare is the big elephant in the room. Social Security is a pittance IMHO.
People going in the direction of self sufficiency and are heavy savers and preppers will largely be unaffected.
How about this idea.
What about working only a few months a year. I'm thinking the winter.
I'm a sun lover. All I want to do in the winter is hibernate anyway. Might as well work.
Then, after few months of working, go into my semi-retirement on the homestead for the spring, summer and fall.
Working only until I reach my predetermined goal of near 10k, or whatever keeps the income tax as low as possible.
With my job, I could do that in less than 2 months.
I work for a contractor for the cable company as an installer. I install cable, internet and phone.
I would think they would hire me any time, especially if I gave them 110% for those few months.
I give "near 99%" now and I have a great rep with the company. I could go back to anyone who has employed me in the last 10 years and go back to work.
We are pretty much ALWAYS hiring. It's very hard to find people of the caliber that the cable company will accept (and accept their work) that will also put up with the work conditions and the hours (7 days a week now).
Satellite and cable installers are always needed all around the country.
I know you think, well they wouldn't want to be jerked around like that...
well, my answer is, they have such a high turnover, they contantly hire and train and lose money on people.
A few onf them stay in the business for an extended time, often going to greener pastures (satellite to cable and back..)
And even those guys will eventually get a good job offer and leave permanently. So it's really kind of a mercenary business.
If i maintain a good rep, I think they would accept it. I would be the only one doing it I am sure.
Plus, it would put me in a great mood/attitude. I could give 110% for a few months if I knew I had the rest of the year off.
I have to wait until my daughter is out on her own, to drop down to a retirement income. So I guess I have at least 7 years before I can do this.
Whadaya think?
What about working only a few months a year. I'm thinking the winter.
I'm a sun lover. All I want to do in the winter is hibernate anyway. Might as well work.
Then, after few months of working, go into my semi-retirement on the homestead for the spring, summer and fall.
Working only until I reach my predetermined goal of near 10k, or whatever keeps the income tax as low as possible.
With my job, I could do that in less than 2 months.
I work for a contractor for the cable company as an installer. I install cable, internet and phone.
I would think they would hire me any time, especially if I gave them 110% for those few months.
I give "near 99%" now and I have a great rep with the company. I could go back to anyone who has employed me in the last 10 years and go back to work.
We are pretty much ALWAYS hiring. It's very hard to find people of the caliber that the cable company will accept (and accept their work) that will also put up with the work conditions and the hours (7 days a week now).
Satellite and cable installers are always needed all around the country.
I know you think, well they wouldn't want to be jerked around like that...
well, my answer is, they have such a high turnover, they contantly hire and train and lose money on people.
A few onf them stay in the business for an extended time, often going to greener pastures (satellite to cable and back..)
And even those guys will eventually get a good job offer and leave permanently. So it's really kind of a mercenary business.
If i maintain a good rep, I think they would accept it. I would be the only one doing it I am sure.
Plus, it would put me in a great mood/attitude. I could give 110% for a few months if I knew I had the rest of the year off.
I have to wait until my daughter is out on her own, to drop down to a retirement income. So I guess I have at least 7 years before I can do this.
Whadaya think?
- Survivalist Mentor
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I'm kind of in the same boat, about 7 more years for the oldest to turn 21.
But, I'd rather wander down to someplace warm for a month or two. The kids will be old enough to keep the house under control.
Then I would work, say, 1 or 2 days a week to reach the appropriate income level.
But, I'd rather wander down to someplace warm for a month or two. The kids will be old enough to keep the house under control.
Then I would work, say, 1 or 2 days a week to reach the appropriate income level.
"What kind of recovery is this? We don't know, but if it continues much longer we'll all be unemployed."-Bill Bonner
"The budget should be balanced, the treasury should be refilled and the pubic debt should be reduced. The arrogance of public officialdom should be tempered and controlled. And the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed, lest we become bankrupt. - Cicero, 63 B.C.
2 Timothy 2:2 The things which you have heard from me in the presence of many witnesses, entrust these to faithful men who will be able to teach others also.
"The budget should be balanced, the treasury should be refilled and the pubic debt should be reduced. The arrogance of public officialdom should be tempered and controlled. And the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed, lest we become bankrupt. - Cicero, 63 B.C.
2 Timothy 2:2 The things which you have heard from me in the presence of many witnesses, entrust these to faithful men who will be able to teach others also.
Retirement and preparedness go hand in hand for us. I will be retiring from the corporate world in less than two years. We have land that is paid off and we will sell out where we currently live. The plan is to build a RV garage/workshop and live in the RV while we build our house. We have done this before and while it doesn't work for everyone it works for us. Fortunately even as I approach 60 God has blessed me and my wife with good health.
Our plans include a raised bed garden, fruit trees, berry bushes, beehives, a small vineyard, a greenhouse and enough cows to keep the land in agriculture tax exemption. We plan on lowline angus cattle since they are smaller and easier to handle, a couple of dexter milk cows and a mixed bag of chickens, guineas, ducks and maybe some turkeys. Our gardening skills are pretty good. We continued to eat things out of our garden all winter long. You just have to plan for fall/winter crops, and do a lot of canning. We already have a year of food stocked up in a couple of locations.
When we build, our plans include solar power, rainwater capture, greywater capture, insulated concrete form house, solar water heater, and as much permaculture techniques as practical. I've been a devotee of Bill Molison for years and have worn out the Permaculture Designers Manual.
We have worked hard all our lives, never took any handouts and don't expect any. We are blessed to be close to debt free and with the military pension and 401K, along with raising our own food, we should be OK. Any SS benefits will be an extra that I don't rely on. Anyway, that's our retirement/preparedness plan.
Our plans include a raised bed garden, fruit trees, berry bushes, beehives, a small vineyard, a greenhouse and enough cows to keep the land in agriculture tax exemption. We plan on lowline angus cattle since they are smaller and easier to handle, a couple of dexter milk cows and a mixed bag of chickens, guineas, ducks and maybe some turkeys. Our gardening skills are pretty good. We continued to eat things out of our garden all winter long. You just have to plan for fall/winter crops, and do a lot of canning. We already have a year of food stocked up in a couple of locations.
When we build, our plans include solar power, rainwater capture, greywater capture, insulated concrete form house, solar water heater, and as much permaculture techniques as practical. I've been a devotee of Bill Molison for years and have worn out the Permaculture Designers Manual.
We have worked hard all our lives, never took any handouts and don't expect any. We are blessed to be close to debt free and with the military pension and 401K, along with raising our own food, we should be OK. Any SS benefits will be an extra that I don't rely on. Anyway, that's our retirement/preparedness plan.
As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord. Joshua 24:15
- Scrooge McDuck
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Making the best of the DASH.
- TSP Pooper-Scooper
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- Death from the knees down
Just adding our story. Twenty years ago my husband got seriously ill, medical bills devastated our nest egg and put us in debt badly. We stopped, took stock of everything and made a few decisions. We sold the fancy house in nice neighborhood, used what equity we had to pay off most of the medical bills and started looking for a place in the country. We found where we live now, it had beautiful land, an old single wide mobile home, and a burned out husk of a barn and a horrible well full of iron and magnesium (manganese? Whatever turns stuff black anyway). We spent 5 years making huge payments so we could pay it off in that time frame. When it was paid for we built a nice barn, a big shop building and witched for a good water supply, then had a new well drilled. During this time we had a huge garden, some chickens and guineas, and lots of horses. Then we decided to build a house. Since we were committed to no mortgage it took us nearly six years but we did it. Three and a half years later hubby became completely disabled. I can't imagine where we would be now if we hadn't made the change in life stlye when we did.
- Prepper
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A few years back, I started thinking "downsize and simplify". I was inspired by a great friend, now deceased, who was in his 80s at the time. He had given away all of his possessions and was living with his various children. He had such joy! I thought, now why do we go through life acquiring possessions, when joy comes from other sources? He loved to get down in the dirt and pull weeds in my garden. He told stories. He loved.
Here's my story...
DH is retired. I was laid off in October. Been paying down the debt for 3 years, and have about 2-3 years to go depending on income (not the mortgage...just everything else). I'm working on building multiple income streams. I still have to get a regular J-O-B due to our current situation, but the goal is to have enough income from other sources in 5-7 years so that I only have to work for someone else if I want to.
We have great gardening skills and other survival-minded friends. We live on 2 acres, and could homestead here. We have a small fruit orchard with about 10 trees: pears, apples, cherries, peaches, plums. Also have perennial crops: asparagus, currants, blueberries, strawberries. We save seeds, and added new heirlooms to our collection this year.
We'd prefer to be further out in the boonies, so we're considering a BOL that will likely become a FT homestead over time. Gotta deal with the debt first. Also, taxes on our current property are $4500/yr...a bit excessive, so long-term homestead here may not be the best option.
DH's parents were depression-era folks, and he grew up in a home that lived very self-sufficiently...growing food, reusing things. I've learned a lot from him. He can fix anything, and loves to cook. (He's very good @ it). He also does our canning.
P.S. I think I need to learn how to hunt. DH and his sons are big fans...I just think I should pick this up as a survival skill. I haven't worked up a passion about it yet...
Here's my story...
DH is retired. I was laid off in October. Been paying down the debt for 3 years, and have about 2-3 years to go depending on income (not the mortgage...just everything else). I'm working on building multiple income streams. I still have to get a regular J-O-B due to our current situation, but the goal is to have enough income from other sources in 5-7 years so that I only have to work for someone else if I want to.
We have great gardening skills and other survival-minded friends. We live on 2 acres, and could homestead here. We have a small fruit orchard with about 10 trees: pears, apples, cherries, peaches, plums. Also have perennial crops: asparagus, currants, blueberries, strawberries. We save seeds, and added new heirlooms to our collection this year.
We'd prefer to be further out in the boonies, so we're considering a BOL that will likely become a FT homestead over time. Gotta deal with the debt first. Also, taxes on our current property are $4500/yr...a bit excessive, so long-term homestead here may not be the best option.
DH's parents were depression-era folks, and he grew up in a home that lived very self-sufficiently...growing food, reusing things. I've learned a lot from him. He can fix anything, and loves to cook. (He's very good @ it). He also does our canning.
P.S. I think I need to learn how to hunt. DH and his sons are big fans...I just think I should pick this up as a survival skill. I haven't worked up a passion about it yet...
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'" Ronald Reagan
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- We all seek direction
At 51 & 52 respectively my wife and I are on our way to a differant lifestyle. Debt pay off is within reach, except for the mortgage which has 12 years if taken to term but we want to sell our condo and get land or a home with land. But that requires a mortgage again.
So do I take the longest loan possible to reduce the payment and know it will be there until I die or I can pay it off, or make it the highest payment for the shortest term that we can afford? My Time frame to go is 3 years to be out of the old and into the new.
I know all the benefits of my own land, in fact I had several great homes before thrown a curve ball in life I am just battling with the finance part all suggestions are appreciated.
So do I take the longest loan possible to reduce the payment and know it will be there until I die or I can pay it off, or make it the highest payment for the shortest term that we can afford? My Time frame to go is 3 years to be out of the old and into the new.
I know all the benefits of my own land, in fact I had several great homes before thrown a curve ball in life I am just battling with the finance part all suggestions are appreciated.
Life is made up of moments of contact no more. Take time to prepare so those moments of contact won't be lost.
Preppers Survive, Survivors Prep!!
http://www.myhomesteadgarden.com/
Preppers Survive, Survivors Prep!!
http://www.myhomesteadgarden.com/
- TSP Pooper-Scooper
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- Death from the knees down
If I were you I'd try to pay off that mortgage as fast as you can. One the best things you can do is live rent/mortgage free when your elderly.True Dat!
We aren't elderly yet but if we had had a mortgage on this place when DH became disabled we'd be in a mess. Those huge payments required a lot of so called sacrifice of other things that turned out to be no sacrifice at all.
- Survivor
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True Dat!My concern is that to stay in CT near the children and to get the type of property we want we will have to maintain a mortgage into our retirement. Keeping the payment low will be the key.
We aren't elderly yet but if we had had a mortgage on this place when DH became disabled we'd be in a mess. Those huge payments required a lot of so called sacrifice of other things that turned out to be no sacrifice at all.
Life is made up of moments of contact no more. Take time to prepare so those moments of contact won't be lost.
Preppers Survive, Survivors Prep!!
http://www.myhomesteadgarden.com/
Preppers Survive, Survivors Prep!!
http://www.myhomesteadgarden.com/
- Survivalist Mentor
- Posts: 918
- Karma: 18
Well you could take a longer term so the payments are liwe but you can voluntarilly make higher payments to lay it off faster. Then if you ever need to lower the payment you won't be penalized.
I'd also recommend taking biweekly payments instead of monthly. Because of the way interest works this will shorten the lenght of your mortgage. It took 7 years off mine!
I'd also recommend taking biweekly payments instead of monthly. Because of the way interest works this will shorten the lenght of your mortgage. It took 7 years off mine!
Freedom is the right of all sentient beings.- Optimus Prime
- Prepper
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wow! Great Thread! THANK YOU FOR PROMOTING FREEDOM!
I'm only 29
and haven't worried so much about retirement until a couple of years ago, when we had a "consultant" coming at work to "advise" us about pension plans (living in UK, that's I think the equivalent of your 401k). I certainly won't let another manicured consultant trying to convince me I should let them in charge of my money so that they can invest in a portfolio of companies such as BP or God knows what, and without any oversight from me on what my money will be used for.
I am slowly taking in that I can only rely on myself and the people who are close to me for when I will retire. One of my nearly-retired colleagues at work has (had?) most of his pension plan with BP, and since what happen in the Gulf is now left with nothing. My father is still living in France, where all pensions are managed by the state, where it is just too evident that the government will default, won't be able to meet its obligation and won't be able to pay for everyone (they are trying to increase the retirement age from 60 to 62 and as a result got >1 million people protesting in the streets... hopeless!)
Thankfully I have no debt - unfortunately I have no assets either.
Thank you again for TSP, it really confirms what I was starting to consider!
It really helps to realise I'm not the only one thinking this way - normally I got the usual dismissal: don't worry it's not the end of the world sort of mentality.
I'm only 29
I am slowly taking in that I can only rely on myself and the people who are close to me for when I will retire. One of my nearly-retired colleagues at work has (had?) most of his pension plan with BP, and since what happen in the Gulf is now left with nothing. My father is still living in France, where all pensions are managed by the state, where it is just too evident that the government will default, won't be able to meet its obligation and won't be able to pay for everyone (they are trying to increase the retirement age from 60 to 62 and as a result got >1 million people protesting in the streets... hopeless!)
Thankfully I have no debt - unfortunately I have no assets either.
Thank you again for TSP, it really confirms what I was starting to consider!
It really helps to realise I'm not the only one thinking this way - normally I got the usual dismissal: don't worry it's not the end of the world sort of mentality.
- Survivalist Mentor
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I'm coming around to thinking that your best bet for "retirement", as in you can no longer care for yourself, is the equity in your home.
Work on paying off your mortgage so you can "live for free" and then when it's time to go to the retirement home you can sell it to pay for your care.
Speaking of France, a friend of mine from France was saying that there is a private plan in France which is kinda like a reverse-mortgage but the payments continue until the death of the home owner.
The kick is however, that once the person dies, the house belongs to the financial company whether he died a week or 50 years after signing.
Work on paying off your mortgage so you can "live for free" and then when it's time to go to the retirement home you can sell it to pay for your care.
Speaking of France, a friend of mine from France was saying that there is a private plan in France which is kinda like a reverse-mortgage but the payments continue until the death of the home owner.
The kick is however, that once the person dies, the house belongs to the financial company whether he died a week or 50 years after signing.
Freedom is the right of all sentient beings.- Optimus Prime
Page 4
- Survivor
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- We all seek direction
Im not ready to make the jump yet I have a lot of work to do but as of now I owe less than 3k on my house I have no credit card bills my truck is paid for. What Im thinking of doing once my house is paid off is getting continuing the expansion of my garden doing food preps and getting some wind and solar going once that is done semi-retiring.Good for you, I hope to be in your position soon!!
Life is made up of moments of contact no more. Take time to prepare so those moments of contact won't be lost.
Preppers Survive, Survivors Prep!!
http://www.myhomesteadgarden.com/
Preppers Survive, Survivors Prep!!
http://www.myhomesteadgarden.com/
- Prepper
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Awesome thread/topic!
This is the type of thing that drove me to TSP. I was out searching for other people with a similar mindset... cause I wasn't having much luck locally.
I just turned 31... and my wife is in her 20's. We bought our house just before marriage 5 and a half years ago, and have been paying extra from the beginning. It will be paid off in under 3 years now, if the plan continues. In the mean time, we've been studying and learning new skillsets and prepping. How to garden, how to preserve, how to create power/heat/energy, how to harvest water and filter it... while getting our orchard & trees planted, maxing out our IRA & 401k retirement plans, & storing useful tools and materials. I figure if we minimize the need for money later, we minimize the amount of time we need to work @ a job. The less time we work at a job, the more time we can spend at home in the garden, with family, and living the simple/good life.
That's why this site is so valuable... it consolidates much of our beliefs. It's nice to see others on a similar path.
This is the type of thing that drove me to TSP. I was out searching for other people with a similar mindset... cause I wasn't having much luck locally.
I just turned 31... and my wife is in her 20's. We bought our house just before marriage 5 and a half years ago, and have been paying extra from the beginning. It will be paid off in under 3 years now, if the plan continues. In the mean time, we've been studying and learning new skillsets and prepping. How to garden, how to preserve, how to create power/heat/energy, how to harvest water and filter it... while getting our orchard & trees planted, maxing out our IRA & 401k retirement plans, & storing useful tools and materials. I figure if we minimize the need for money later, we minimize the amount of time we need to work @ a job. The less time we work at a job, the more time we can spend at home in the garden, with family, and living the simple/good life.
That's why this site is so valuable... it consolidates much of our beliefs. It's nice to see others on a similar path.
- Prepper
- Posts: 23
- Karma: 1
- Sustainable living in the high desert
I recently discovered TSP, and this thread convinced me to join the forums. "Prepping for retirement" has been my goal for several years now, ever since I realized that financial independence, self-sufficiency, and homesteading form a truly comprehensive "preparedness plan": if you aren't dependent on an external job or external food supply, you can weather a lot of storms. Plus, you have the flexibility to do what you want to do, instead of what you have to do.
I currently live in a medium-sized city, but have a 40-acre off-grid property about a few hours' drive away. I go up a couple times a month to work on it, carpooling with my boyfriend who owns the parcel next to mine (on a side note, we often download TSP shows and listen to them on the drive!
). Over the years I've put in a well, a septic system, solar power, and just passed the rough-in inspection on my house. The property will be paid off next year, I'll be debt-free in just over two years, and I'm building on the property as I can afford it. My goal is to semi-retire at age 50 (8 years), but I could move there sooner since I telecommute.
An additional perk is that when people ask about my property, I don't have to stumble around to avoid the "survival compound" label. I tell them "it's my retirement". And they're jealous.
I currently live in a medium-sized city, but have a 40-acre off-grid property about a few hours' drive away. I go up a couple times a month to work on it, carpooling with my boyfriend who owns the parcel next to mine (on a side note, we often download TSP shows and listen to them on the drive!
An additional perk is that when people ask about my property, I don't have to stumble around to avoid the "survival compound" label. I tell them "it's my retirement". And they're jealous.
Micro-homesteader, organic gardener, permaculture fanatic, CSA member, health nut, Crossfit junkie, tightwad. http:// www.theindependentspirit.com
- Survivalist Mentor
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- Karma: 18
I recently discovered TSP, and this thread convinced me to join the forums. "Prepping for retirement" has been my goal for several years now, ever since I realized that financial independence, self-sufficiency, and homesteading form a truly comprehensive "preparedness plan": if you aren't dependent on an external job or external food supply, you can weather a lot of storms. Plus, you have the flexibility to do what you want to do, instead of what you have to do.That's pretty awesome, I'm so jealous.
I currently live in a medium-sized city, but have a 40-acre off-grid property about a few hours' drive away. I go up a couple times a month to work on it, carpooling with my boyfriend who owns the parcel next to mine (on a side note, we often download TSP shows and listen to them on the drive!). Over the years I've put in a well, a septic system, solar power, and just passed the rough-in inspection on my house. The property will be paid off next year, I'll be debt-free in just over two years, and I'm building on the property as I can afford it. My goal is to semi-retire at age 50 (8 years), but I could move there sooner since I telecommute.
An additional perk is that when people ask about my property, I don't have to stumble around to avoid the "survival compound" label. I tell them "it's my retirement". And they're jealous.
My plan is pretty similar to yours. I'm also hoping to retire around 50 even though I'll take a hit on my pension. With prepping you don't need as high an income so I probably won't notice the difference in income.
Freedom is the right of all sentient beings.- Optimus Prime
- Survivalist Mentor
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- Chief Engineer
I joined TSP about a month ago, after finding the thread What Did You Do Today To Prepare (http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=87.0 ). I was hooked and spent many hours reading through that entire thread (all 260+ pages
).
Now that I've gotten caught up in that thread, I've been looking around and found this thread. The title piqued my interest and I started reading. Well, I just about broke down and cried. I am 50 and have taken the system's definition, swallowing it, hook, line, sinker, bobber, rod, reel, etc.
I am now looking into paying as hard as possible on my debt (mostly gone, thank God), getting a BOL/Homestead outside the city and moving out there within a few years. I am also looking at cashing in my IRA and 401K for gold and silver, or maybe a "retirement property". Still have some research to do on that stuff though. Our youngest is still 15, and I would like to be moving shortly after he moves out. That gives me between about four and six years or so to work on this.
What I want is to be able to (before I turn 60 or 65):
- Produce 100% of my energy needs
- Produce 100%+ of my food needs (enough extra to tithe, give to family/friends/neighbors/needy and some extra to sell)
- Be totally debt-free.
- Have enough in food storage that we can survive an extended period of poor health (although, cleaner living may eliminate this need, I still want the stores)
I am looking into a large garden and small orchard for much of my fruits and vegetables, a small aqua-ponics system to provide more veggies and fish (figuring probably channel cats at this time) and some small livestock (perhaps rabbits, chickens and maybe a couple of milk and meat goats - after a half-a-century of city-slicking, I'm not ready to start riding a horse and herding a hundred head of cattle
). I will probably also try to get some extra meat through hunting, although historically I could be considered a vegetarian there (vegetarian - old Indian term meaning "lousy hunter"
)
I will work self-employed (along with the sales of some food items) for the little bit of money that I will need to spend on repairs and entertainments.
Still stuck deeply in the planning/research stages of this though. Any thoughts?
Now that I've gotten caught up in that thread, I've been looking around and found this thread. The title piqued my interest and I started reading. Well, I just about broke down and cried. I am 50 and have taken the system's definition, swallowing it, hook, line, sinker, bobber, rod, reel, etc.
:(" hash="41da0d4acde8b55abf10887d0ccc575b" height="15" style="cursor: default;cursor: default;cursor: default;" type="image/png" width="15"/>
I thought that the only way to retire was to have enough in "investments" that I could live off the interest returns for the rest of eternity - or at least until I died. This thread does give me some hope, but I have thrown away a large chunk of my retirement preparations buying into that system. I have not been able to put much into my retirement plans, and was getting worried. I just never thought about preparedness as a retirement plan.I am now looking into paying as hard as possible on my debt (mostly gone, thank God), getting a BOL/Homestead outside the city and moving out there within a few years. I am also looking at cashing in my IRA and 401K for gold and silver, or maybe a "retirement property". Still have some research to do on that stuff though. Our youngest is still 15, and I would like to be moving shortly after he moves out. That gives me between about four and six years or so to work on this.
What I want is to be able to (before I turn 60 or 65):
- Produce 100% of my energy needs
- Produce 100%+ of my food needs (enough extra to tithe, give to family/friends/neighbors/needy and some extra to sell)
- Be totally debt-free.
- Have enough in food storage that we can survive an extended period of poor health (although, cleaner living may eliminate this need, I still want the stores)
I am looking into a large garden and small orchard for much of my fruits and vegetables, a small aqua-ponics system to provide more veggies and fish (figuring probably channel cats at this time) and some small livestock (perhaps rabbits, chickens and maybe a couple of milk and meat goats - after a half-a-century of city-slicking, I'm not ready to start riding a horse and herding a hundred head of cattle
I will work self-employed (along with the sales of some food items) for the little bit of money that I will need to spend on repairs and entertainments.
Still stuck deeply in the planning/research stages of this though. Any thoughts?
ChEng
"Cap'n, she canna take much more of this... My poor country 'tis startin ta fall apart!"
"Cap'n, she canna take much more of this... My poor country 'tis startin ta fall apart!"
- Survivalist Mentor
- Posts: 918
- Karma: 18
sounds great to me!
The only thing that would worry me a bit though is cashing out your 401k because I understand you take a big penalty for doing that (I'm Canadian so I'm not sure how it works).
Do you have any income besides your 401k that can provide for you when you reach retirement age?
IMO, although it might be a good good to produce 100% of your own food, I don't think it's realistic for most people, especially elderly people.
I'd like to be able to produce at least 25% of my own food eventually, maybe as much as 50%. I'll need an income to make up the other 50%.
100% of your energy needs is quite possible however.
Do you plan on building a new home? If so I'd recommend building very energy efficiently and no larger than what your minimum needs. It's cheaper to conserve energy than create it.
The only thing that would worry me a bit though is cashing out your 401k because I understand you take a big penalty for doing that (I'm Canadian so I'm not sure how it works).
Do you have any income besides your 401k that can provide for you when you reach retirement age?
IMO, although it might be a good good to produce 100% of your own food, I don't think it's realistic for most people, especially elderly people.
I'd like to be able to produce at least 25% of my own food eventually, maybe as much as 50%. I'll need an income to make up the other 50%.
100% of your energy needs is quite possible however.
Do you plan on building a new home? If so I'd recommend building very energy efficiently and no larger than what your minimum needs. It's cheaper to conserve energy than create it.
Freedom is the right of all sentient beings.- Optimus Prime
- Resident Master Mudder
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ChEng,
We share your pain. Rather late in the game we realized that we had been squandering a lot of our resources along the way. However, all is not lost. (We still have our health lol).
We are planning to move to an already purchased piece of land, build our own homestead and live on probably 1/3 the income to which we have grown accustomed. We are trying out the budget now (approx. 2 years before the plan goes live) to see if we can live within the income we'll have coming in... so far, so good, but it is a big difference. We are looking out for other income options as well as planning to downsize our expenses.
I'd be wary about cashing out the 401k's unless that is the only option... the penalties are quite high, from what I've heard. Besides, you aren't that far away from being able to access it without penalties, right? With the timeframe you have, you ought to be able to save a huge amount of cash by reducing the lifestyle expenses now. You can save the cash you'll need over the next few years if you put your mind to it. Another thing to consider, is that I think you may be able to access the 401k without penalty for things like your child's education expenses... (check it out, I'm no expert).
We share your pain. Rather late in the game we realized that we had been squandering a lot of our resources along the way. However, all is not lost. (We still have our health lol).
We are planning to move to an already purchased piece of land, build our own homestead and live on probably 1/3 the income to which we have grown accustomed. We are trying out the budget now (approx. 2 years before the plan goes live) to see if we can live within the income we'll have coming in... so far, so good, but it is a big difference. We are looking out for other income options as well as planning to downsize our expenses.
I'd be wary about cashing out the 401k's unless that is the only option... the penalties are quite high, from what I've heard. Besides, you aren't that far away from being able to access it without penalties, right? With the timeframe you have, you ought to be able to save a huge amount of cash by reducing the lifestyle expenses now. You can save the cash you'll need over the next few years if you put your mind to it. Another thing to consider, is that I think you may be able to access the 401k without penalty for things like your child's education expenses... (check it out, I'm no expert).
- Survivalist Mentor
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- Chief Engineer
The only thing that would worry me a bit though is cashing out your 401k because I understand you take a big penalty for doing that (I'm Canadian so I'm not sure how it works).Cool Blue, Yeah, that could cause troubles - I know that I can swap it for gold, silver, real-estate with no tax penalty, looking into the rest. My second oldest son is just about to graduate with his Accounting and Financial Planning degrees - he is being shanghaied into consulting for his Mom and Dad - he just hasn't heard about that yet.
Do you have any income besides your 401k that can provide for you when you reach retirement age?
IMO, although it might be a good good to produce 100% of your own food, I don't think it's realistic for most people, especially elderly people.Those are the goals, right now. Hopefully, I will be able to meet them, but if not, then part of my planning is to come up with Plan B ( and C and D and B.1, C.1, C.2, etc) We'll see what happens. Either way, my current investment is so low, that I would only be able to last about 6-12 months before they all go dry.
I'd like to be able to produce at least 25% of my own food eventually, maybe as much as 50%. I'll need an income to make up the other 50%.
100% of your energy needs is quite possible however.
Do you plan on building a new home? If so I'd recommend building very energy efficiently and no larger than what your minimum needs. It's cheaper to conserve energy than create it.I keep wavering between building and buying and putting a mobile home up and parking an RV/Camper there. A lot will depend on what I find as a BOL/Homestead. One option that I am looking into is a buried/partially buried house - those can be pretty efficient. Still looking (an droolin', an slobberin' an wishin'...) I've got about 20-25 years of thinking and research behind me on this type stuff, and like I said - lots will depend on what I find. One good thing is that the kids are now thinking about having a cabin on a vacation spot, where they can go to relax from society's stress and to use as a BOL. We may use them to help fund a place and set up a couple of outbuildings/cottages around the main house for their families (properly stocked against SHTF situations, of course
I'd be wary about cashing out the 401k's unless that is the only option... the penalties are quite high, from what I've heard. Besides, you aren't that far away from being able to access it without penalties, right? With the timeframe you have, you ought to be able to save a huge amount of cash by reducing the lifestyle expenses now. You can save the cash you'll need over the next few years if you put your mind to it. Another thing to consider, is that I think you may be able to access the 401k without penalty for things like your child's education expenses... (check it out, I'm no expert).LvsChant, Yeah, you are right, things like that can lead to disaster. I am studying on it now (see above about the forced slavery for my son
ChEng,CdnGuy, Thanks, yes I am pretty educated. Mostly self-study on this stuff. And yes, I am an engineer. In my post on the Intro thread, I mention that I am starting up a small business designing and selling kits and text material for engineering students. (My business' tag line is "Helping to build a better engineer) The kits are mostly electronic, control system and robotics. One of the things that I am working on for the next five years (until our son, Peter, moves out) is to get my business rolling enough to allow me to drop out of the "rat race". That should be enough time to either get enough into investments for me to retire or to be able to sell and set up another business that I can run from the boonies - or maybe continue with that if I can get close enough to a shipping organization that I can ship and receive.
You are obviously a smart, if not well educated, guy. You'll figure it out. It's all cost-to-benefit really. Just don't get stuck in the analysis paralysis.
I'm guessing you're an engineer yourself? Or at least a really technical guy? You might be surprised how well you could do going out on your own.
Just keep on trucking.
The analysis paralysis is a definite potential problem for me. I have been thinking about this and researching so much, that I have ton's (metric, even!
Edited: Wow, did that get wordy! See my Intro post about my Gift of Gab
ChEng
"Cap'n, she canna take much more of this... My poor country 'tis startin ta fall apart!"
"Cap'n, she canna take much more of this... My poor country 'tis startin ta fall apart!"
- Survivor
- Posts: 191
- Karma: 5
- We all seek direction
Still stuck deeply in the planning/research stages of this though. Any thoughts?
One year ago we were in the same position, much desire and over 50. Well 1 year later credit card debt gone, car payment paid down to 6 monthe left, about 30 days worth of food, learned to can and dehydrate, had a 4 x 4 garden at our condo that produced some food. Started to build the 1st aid supplies, working on paying off and getting out of the condo. Yiou cant expect to buy yourself into this lifestyle it takes work small steps in the right direction within your means, to reach your goals. Being in yoyur 50's is hard having a teenager at homeis tough, my youngest is 16 so I relate. But this year has taught her lessons as well.
Teach yourself something, can you bake or make a lanyard from paracord, how about sharpen a knife, shoot a gun, fish? There is so much to learn. Winter is coming pick something and just do it, learn it and then do something else. This is my passion and I will keep doing it until I can't. Good luck and don't give up
One year ago we were in the same position, much desire and over 50. Well 1 year later credit card debt gone, car payment paid down to 6 monthe left, about 30 days worth of food, learned to can and dehydrate, had a 4 x 4 garden at our condo that produced some food. Started to build the 1st aid supplies, working on paying off and getting out of the condo. Yiou cant expect to buy yourself into this lifestyle it takes work small steps in the right direction within your means, to reach your goals. Being in yoyur 50's is hard having a teenager at homeis tough, my youngest is 16 so I relate. But this year has taught her lessons as well.
Teach yourself something, can you bake or make a lanyard from paracord, how about sharpen a knife, shoot a gun, fish? There is so much to learn. Winter is coming pick something and just do it, learn it and then do something else. This is my passion and I will keep doing it until I can't. Good luck and don't give up
Life is made up of moments of contact no more. Take time to prepare so those moments of contact won't be lost.
Preppers Survive, Survivors Prep!!
http://www.myhomesteadgarden.com/
Preppers Survive, Survivors Prep!!
http://www.myhomesteadgarden.com/
- Survivalist Mentor
- Posts: 314
- Karma: 23
- Chief Engineer
Still stuck deeply in the planning/research stages of this though. Any thoughts?Oh yeah, I'm not too shabby at cooking (unless you compare me to Mrs. ChEng - then I'm hopelessly lost, but then again so are most people
One year ago we were in the same position, much desire and over 50. Well 1 year later credit card debt gone, car payment paid down to 6 monthe left, about 30 days worth of food, learned to can and dehydrate, had a 4 x 4 garden at our condo that produced some food. Started to build the 1st aid supplies, working on paying off and getting out of the condo. Yiou cant expect to buy yourself into this lifestyle it takes work small steps in the right direction within your means, to reach your goals. Being in yoyur 50's is hard having a teenager at homeis tough, my youngest is 16 so I relate. But this year has taught her lessons as well.
Teach yourself something, can you bake or make a lanyard from paracord, how about sharpen a knife, shoot a gun, fish? There is so much to learn. Winter is coming pick something and just do it, learn it and then do something else. This is my passion and I will keep doing it until I can't. Good luck and don't give up
Like you said, pick a skill and learn - I was working on learning to make bannock. This is a type of flat-bread with endless possibilities. I was chronicalling it on the What Did You Do Today To Prepare thread, but ran out of flour. We now have flour and I will get back to my experiments soon. The shotgun is up at my son's, and I will probably bring it home this Thanksgiving - we are going up there for dinner. I will also see if he has an old .22 or something that I can steal from him. I used to be a pretty good shot (earned my marksman ribbon before getting out of the Air Force) and I will get back in shape there - also, my wife told me that I am to start taking the younger ones out to the range. I told her that she is to join us and she said OK - she hasn't fired a weapon since basic training back in '79.
I am also stocking up (that will go with us whenever we move) on food supplies and other things, working on building up the EDC and the BOB and the First Aid Kits. So, while it is mostly research and planning, there is still a large component of the practical to my preps. Thanks for reminding me to stay practical, Max.
ChEng
"Cap'n, she canna take much more of this... My poor country 'tis startin ta fall apart!"
"Cap'n, she canna take much more of this... My poor country 'tis startin ta fall apart!"
- Prepper
- Posts: 21
- Karma: 0
I was forced to retire due to a disability at work. I got my pension and a plus amount the equaled social security at age 55 and we made plans to move to Alaska. We were always preppers and if we had plans it was to work tilll 62 and get 42 years retirement instead of 30. But we can never plan for the unexpected, just be ready to change plans. We have a small garden and can salmon, and moose. We learned to live with life gave us and live comfortably. But if any one was to have told us we would be retiring at 55 I would have said they were crazy.
- Prepper
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I moved from Dallas, TX to an old house in the country 17 years ago and bought a small business in a small town.
I've had some wonderful successes gardening and some dismal failures but I've learned much.
The house was livable but I've spent years getting it in good repair. I'm focused now on landscaping with food forests in mind. Don't know how much of it will produce in my lifetime but I'm planting things for both long and short term production. Time has always been an issue as I'm a single parent. I'm hoping to work smarter instead of harder and although I cannot do an irrigation system I'm looking at other methods to hold water around plantings far from the house. (Burried hay and water pots?) My main gardening will be done now in a raised bed just outside my kitchen door. As I sit on a hill I hope to plant other things in swales below the raised bed. My traditional garden spot is lovely and may be used once again if I ever retire. I suspect I may produce more in the raised beds with row covers and the convenience of tending things just outside my door. Whatever comes this is fun and so much more so hearing your stories as well!
My oh my time has flown since I first wrote this post. There is so much to share!
Since that time, I started my own website with a Canadian flavour on the topic of preparedness. It's been growing slowly, but that's also in direct proportion to the amount of time I've spent on it. I've been wrapped up in a project at work and my wife had started a new job that consumed just about every waking moment of her life. Seriously. She was managing a hotel. She had never managed a hotel, but within a year and half her hotel was named number 2 for that brand WORLDWIDE. You know this brand, so to make number 2 spot while being located in central Alberta is a HUGE success for anyone, let alone a newbie with no formal education. Then, someone somewhere up the line got a little upset that an unknown could do so well. Well, that all turned into a living hell!
Along the way, we took a trip to Nova Scotia for 6 days. First vacation either of us has had. We fell in love with the people and the place. My wife had been there several times when she used to be a long haul driver, and both of us had known many Maritimers throughout our lives so the reputation of their hospitality and such has always been with us.
Fueled by distaste for the increasingly bureaucratic ways and cut-throat business in Alberta, my sweetie started looking at properties down east. Our dream of having an acreage that we could 'retire' to in the preparedness lifestyle in Alberta had vanished, with even the most isolated acreages costing in the $400,000 and up range. Well, didn't she find 3 acres, with an old farmhouse and shop for $30,000.
After having a home inspector check it out and send us a highly detailed reports with tens of pages of pictures of everything he saw, we made the offer and bought it. Maybe not the smartest thing to do without having actually walked the land, but we felt confident in our home inspector and in the survey report that an old friend of mine, who lives down there, sent me.
The home inspector we ended up getting was the head of the home inspector's association for Nova Scotia. There was no one in our area, so he drove the 2 hours from Halifax to check it out for us. His final recommendation? If we don't buy it, he will.
We flew down on a Thursday evening to finish the paperwork and close the deal. We went to the house and toured it. The home inspection was exactly representative of what was there. Quickly, we winterized the home. Then we met the neighbours. Oh, the neighbours! You'll be relieved to know that people with good hearts who do the right things because it's the right thing to do, still exist. (Of course they do, most of you are those kind of people too!)
We had coffee with them and could have spent the whole night just visiting. They offered right out of the gate to keep an eye on our home for us. They told us of the wonderful old couple that used to live there and the history of the land. The neighbour did a lot of the work on that place and was very open with us. The more we heard, the more we knew that this place was for us out of something more like fate than just luck and some haphazard planning. This place was meant for us to retire to in 10 or 15 years.
Okay, my sweetie sped that up by about 10 or 15 years!! LOL! (I can laugh now that the panic attacks have stopped.) The hotel situation drove her to find another job. Another job in Nova Scotia! So, right now my sweetie, our daughter, and our dog are in the new-old home, peeling layers of wallpaper and planning the garden while I'm here in Central Alberta getting our house here ready to sell. It's listed now by the way.
Once this house sells, I'll honour my commitment to my employer, who is a good man of his word and a mentor to me, then I'll join my sweetie in our mortgage-free acreage in Nova Scotia. At that point, we won't owe anyone a dime.
True to our vision of preparedness as a retirement plan, we'll continue to work jobs, work on making the acreage as self-sufficient as we can, and enjoy the moments that we couldn't have in the rat race here. Don't get me wrong! Alberta has some of the best people you'll ever meet! It will always be the energy that drives Canada, and I don't just mean oil and gas! But we'll be able to enjoy the fruits of our labour and visit with neighbours, play cards, drink coffee and get back to building on the website I started more frequently like the good people of Canada deserve.
It's terrifying in many ways - such a large change in almost every aspect of my life. Yet it is also the beginning of the realization of our dreams and something I preached here a couple years ago now.
I hope this has been inspiring, or at least entertaining, to you in some way. I'd love to read how you are progressing on making preparedness your retirement plan.
Since that time, I started my own website with a Canadian flavour on the topic of preparedness. It's been growing slowly, but that's also in direct proportion to the amount of time I've spent on it. I've been wrapped up in a project at work and my wife had started a new job that consumed just about every waking moment of her life. Seriously. She was managing a hotel. She had never managed a hotel, but within a year and half her hotel was named number 2 for that brand WORLDWIDE. You know this brand, so to make number 2 spot while being located in central Alberta is a HUGE success for anyone, let alone a newbie with no formal education. Then, someone somewhere up the line got a little upset that an unknown could do so well. Well, that all turned into a living hell!
Along the way, we took a trip to Nova Scotia for 6 days. First vacation either of us has had. We fell in love with the people and the place. My wife had been there several times when she used to be a long haul driver, and both of us had known many Maritimers throughout our lives so the reputation of their hospitality and such has always been with us.
Fueled by distaste for the increasingly bureaucratic ways and cut-throat business in Alberta, my sweetie started looking at properties down east. Our dream of having an acreage that we could 'retire' to in the preparedness lifestyle in Alberta had vanished, with even the most isolated acreages costing in the $400,000 and up range. Well, didn't she find 3 acres, with an old farmhouse and shop for $30,000.
After having a home inspector check it out and send us a highly detailed reports with tens of pages of pictures of everything he saw, we made the offer and bought it. Maybe not the smartest thing to do without having actually walked the land, but we felt confident in our home inspector and in the survey report that an old friend of mine, who lives down there, sent me.
The home inspector we ended up getting was the head of the home inspector's association for Nova Scotia. There was no one in our area, so he drove the 2 hours from Halifax to check it out for us. His final recommendation? If we don't buy it, he will.
We flew down on a Thursday evening to finish the paperwork and close the deal. We went to the house and toured it. The home inspection was exactly representative of what was there. Quickly, we winterized the home. Then we met the neighbours. Oh, the neighbours! You'll be relieved to know that people with good hearts who do the right things because it's the right thing to do, still exist. (Of course they do, most of you are those kind of people too!)
We had coffee with them and could have spent the whole night just visiting. They offered right out of the gate to keep an eye on our home for us. They told us of the wonderful old couple that used to live there and the history of the land. The neighbour did a lot of the work on that place and was very open with us. The more we heard, the more we knew that this place was for us out of something more like fate than just luck and some haphazard planning. This place was meant for us to retire to in 10 or 15 years.
Okay, my sweetie sped that up by about 10 or 15 years!! LOL! (I can laugh now that the panic attacks have stopped.) The hotel situation drove her to find another job. Another job in Nova Scotia! So, right now my sweetie, our daughter, and our dog are in the new-old home, peeling layers of wallpaper and planning the garden while I'm here in Central Alberta getting our house here ready to sell. It's listed now by the way.
Once this house sells, I'll honour my commitment to my employer, who is a good man of his word and a mentor to me, then I'll join my sweetie in our mortgage-free acreage in Nova Scotia. At that point, we won't owe anyone a dime.
True to our vision of preparedness as a retirement plan, we'll continue to work jobs, work on making the acreage as self-sufficient as we can, and enjoy the moments that we couldn't have in the rat race here. Don't get me wrong! Alberta has some of the best people you'll ever meet! It will always be the energy that drives Canada, and I don't just mean oil and gas! But we'll be able to enjoy the fruits of our labour and visit with neighbours, play cards, drink coffee and get back to building on the website I started more frequently like the good people of Canada deserve.
It's terrifying in many ways - such a large change in almost every aspect of my life. Yet it is also the beginning of the realization of our dreams and something I preached here a couple years ago now.
I hope this has been inspiring, or at least entertaining, to you in some way. I'd love to read how you are progressing on making preparedness your retirement plan.
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I am going to read that update and another listeners story today on the air, today's topic will be, "Creating Your Vision of Freedom". I wasn't sure what to do today but that just pushed it over the top. I am SO happy for you brother! You just got more than a decade of your life back, wow! Terrifying, well when you let a caged bird go free it is terrifying at first too.
Jack Spirko
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"If some of our teenage thrill seeker really want to go out and get a thrill. Let them go up into the north west and let them tangle with a Grizzly bear or Polar bear or brown bear and get that effect that will cleanse the soul". ~ Fred Bear
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"If some of our teenage thrill seeker really want to go out and get a thrill. Let them go up into the north west and let them tangle with a Grizzly bear or Polar bear or brown bear and get that effect that will cleanse the soul". ~ Fred Bear
Nice to hear from you, CdnGuy. I thought you were off the forum but I'm glad to hear things are going well.
You might be interested in the ten-book prepper novel series called 299 Days. I, like, wrote it and stuff. Prepper Press is publishing it. Seriously. Check out www.299Days.com .
"If you pissed away your time and energy watching football and herding the family to endless soccer games, well, sorry grasshopper." -- post by jasonthomas on TSP
I am going to read that update and another listeners story today on the air, today's topic will be, "Creating Your Vision of Freedom". I wasn't sure what to do today but that just pushed it over the top. I am SO happy for you brother! You just got more than a decade of your life back, wow! Terrifying, well when you let a caged bird go free it is terrifying at first too.Thank you Jack and HeavyG. You guys inspire me! Heck, my wife even listens to your show now. For some reason, she didn't like the way you sounded at first. But then you got the new microphone and such and she got past the Jersey/Texas/Penn accent and heard the heart of you and your message. I think she realized she was hearing a more advance version of me and now she just loves your show.
Whenever we had a few moments in the truck together, she'd actually ask if I had a new Survival Podcast. Heck yes!!!
It's funny, when I saw the title of the podcast and the show description, I thought, "Wow, huh, isn't that a coincidence that I just wrote an update about our journey last night. Cosmic consciousness at work!"
Jack, HeavyG, Sister, Bad_Synergy, etc...too many to mention. Thank you for all you do for all of us.
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Okay, I just listened to the podcast and thank you for your encouragement! I really have to give about 90% of the credit to my sweetie. She did the footwork to find this place, I mostly provided the dreaming and kept going to work.
Yes, we will have no car payments, no mortgage, and no loans once the Alberta home is sold. The taxes - about $300 a year.
We have a good 5 years of work ahead of us to get the acreage to where we want it to be, in terms of production and style.
Now, here's the best part - how this is going to benefit our kids. Our daughter is 5'10" tall and an aggressive basketball player as well as an honour roll student. She is now attending a high school next to one of Canada's oldest and best universities. You can see where this is going, right? The opportunity for her to go to university and become a national level player has just increased by a magnitude! (She's actually my step-daughter, but that distinction doesn't matter.)
My son, who lives with his mom 10 months out of the year, will now be within a 16 hour drive instead of a 5 day drive. His ticket to fly to me drops from somewhere around $800 to about $180.
The oldest boy is in college here and living his own life. He's doing very well! I'm very glad for him, and proud of him. Should he decide to pursue graduate studies or just make a change in his life, well, there will be a launching pad for him in Nova Scotia.
Those three things are the real benefit. Family. That's what it's about.
Yes, we will have no car payments, no mortgage, and no loans once the Alberta home is sold. The taxes - about $300 a year.
We have a good 5 years of work ahead of us to get the acreage to where we want it to be, in terms of production and style.
Now, here's the best part - how this is going to benefit our kids. Our daughter is 5'10" tall and an aggressive basketball player as well as an honour roll student. She is now attending a high school next to one of Canada's oldest and best universities. You can see where this is going, right? The opportunity for her to go to university and become a national level player has just increased by a magnitude! (She's actually my step-daughter, but that distinction doesn't matter.)
My son, who lives with his mom 10 months out of the year, will now be within a 16 hour drive instead of a 5 day drive. His ticket to fly to me drops from somewhere around $800 to about $180.
The oldest boy is in college here and living his own life. He's doing very well! I'm very glad for him, and proud of him. Should he decide to pursue graduate studies or just make a change in his life, well, there will be a launching pad for him in Nova Scotia.
Those three things are the real benefit. Family. That's what it's about.
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CdnGuy... I am so happy for you. My husband has about 13 months to go before he retires and he describes it as the feeling of knowing you are going to win the lottery. The anticipation!Took me a while to realize that, but yes, it is like winning the lottery in many ways.
It sounds like the two of you won the lottery, too. Best of luck to you.
When my dad bought our first home for $100 down, and found that he could subdivide it into 3 lots, he told one of his co-workers that this was his winning lottery ticket. I didn't hear that story until a few months after my father passed away.
Well, I think this is our family's winning lottery ticket.
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CdnGuy - Since your story was put out on the podcast it has help kick my family into high gear. My wife and I had our first meeting last night about where we are headed. We are going to have a planning/vision casting meeting again on Sunday. So thanks for share and let'ing Jack share on the show.Man, this is something I need to get my wife to do. Any advice on how to approach it? It seems like she doesn't want to face facts and just bury her head and keep spending money on junk to distract her from the problems.
Rook
The other night I asked her what her plan is and what she wants out of life, her reply was "I don't know."
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I shared my vision with my wife today and we are on the same page! Last week I accepted a new job in a totally new career field. The job is in health care and the company is willing to train me. There are endless opportunities to expand this new career. So, my vision is as follows. We are in our early 30's with no debt. In the next 2 years we plan to buy a house in rural NW Ohio. Fortunately this job is located in the town I grew up in. Great place to start a family! We want a rural home with a basement. With this home I plan to have chickens and a larger more productive garden. I also plan to find a mentor for hunting through the local sportsmans club. This way I can procure most of our meat from wild game. To supplement wild game I plan to buy a hog from a local farmer or meat market. I plan to buy apples from a local orchard and make my own apple sauce and can peaches just like my parents did. When our children are born, they will begin to learn how to thrive in a frugal household, and help us tend the garden and chickens. They will also learn from me how to hunt and other "guy skills" and from my wife they will learn how to cook and speak Chinese and Malay. I plan to further my new career by obtaining my RN thus earning more $$ and paying down our debt on the home we intend to buy. I also plan to save for my children's college so when they graduate they have no debt. My parents did the same for me and my grandparents did the same for them. I believe with our current frugal lifestyle this vision is possible!
NATE
"This is the Law of the Yukon, that only the Strong shall thrive;
That surely the Weak shall perish, and only the Fit survive." Robert Service
"This is the Law of the Yukon, that only the Strong shall thrive;
That surely the Weak shall perish, and only the Fit survive." Robert Service
High five to you guys who are getting your wives on board.
There's a thread on this very topic: http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=3239.0
There's a thread on this very topic: http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=3239.0
You might be interested in the ten-book prepper novel series called 299 Days. I, like, wrote it and stuff. Prepper Press is publishing it. Seriously. Check out www.299Days.com .
"If you pissed away your time and energy watching football and herding the family to endless soccer games, well, sorry grasshopper." -- post by jasonthomas on TSP
CdnGuy - Since your story was put out on the podcast it has help kick my family into high gear. My wife and I had our first meeting last night about where we are headed. We are going to have a planning/vision casting meeting again on Sunday. So thanks for share and let'ing Jack share on the show.Fantastic! I wish nothing but the best for your family. Jack is obviously a big inspiration as are all the other really cool people on this forum. One of my core beliefs is that my life should serve as an example to others, or at least as a warning. LOL!
Rook
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Man, this is something I need to get my wife to do. Any advice on how to approach it? It seems like she doesn't want to face facts and just bury her head and keep spending money on junk to distract her from the problems.The thread that Heavy G mentioned is excellent. I think there was even a podcast episode awhile back that addressed getting reluctant spouses on board. Might be a good time for Jack to revisit that soon.
The other night I asked her what her plan is and what she wants out of life, her reply was "I don't know."
There really is no sound reasoning against incorporating preparedness into your life at least a little. We prepare by having insurance, wills, smoke detectors, etc. Just bump it up a little bit. Grow some counter-top herbs and then make her favourite dinner for her with them. Little stuff like that. Make sure her car is kitted out with roadside assistance stuff - it's a good way to show her you love her. If she thinks you're nuts, tell her that you'll do whatever it takes to be able to see her sweet smile every night. How do you argue against that?
Let me tell you a little story...
One day I was out shoveling the sidewalk, and I wanted to get it BARE. I hate snow on my sidewalk. Okay, I just hate snow. I chipped at the ice, I got a stable broom and swept the sidewalk. I think my sweetie thought I was nuts. Maybe I am. But then I told her about a neighbour I had when I was about 12.
This gentleman was a man's man and a very gentle man. Every time the snow fell, he was out there clearing his driveway and sidewalk just like I was doing now. No matter the time of winter his driveway was black and ice free and his sidewalk was clear with a few inches on either side. I thought he was just bored or obsessive. Then I asked him why he cleared his driveway and sidewalk so well.
He leaned on his shovel, cocked his winter hat up a bit so he could look right at me. With a serious face but soft eyes he said, "My wife is very ill and has been for a long time. If something should happen, I want the ambulance and medics to be able to get to her as quickly and safely as possible. I love her and I don't want to lose her because I didn't shovel the walk."
It hit me hard then as a 12-year old. It hit me harder as a man with a wonderful wife and family.
That last sentence can end with any number of things...
I love her and I don't want to lose her because I didn't have a first aid kit.
I love her and I don't want to lose her because I didn't have any savings.
I love her and I don't want to lose her because I didn't change the batteries in the smoke detector.
I love her and I don't want to lose her because I didn't do something to help in hard times.
And most importantly...
I love her and I don't want to lose her because I didn't tell her and show her I love her.
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Man, this is something I need to get my wife to do. Any advice on how to approach it? It seems like she doesn't want to face facts and just bury her head and keep spending money on junk to distract her from the problems.Personally when she said, I don't know, I would simply of ask, "honey would you like to know, would you like to be able to answer that question"?
The other night I asked her what her plan is and what she wants out of life, her reply was "I don't know."
It is amazing what asking a person can do vs. telling a person something. Because when she says, yes, you simply say well, can we try to find that together. Hell, lets face it guys, Dr. Phil is crap compared to a good salesman,
Jack Spirko
The Survival Podcast
"If some of our teenage thrill seeker really want to go out and get a thrill. Let them go up into the north west and let them tangle with a Grizzly bear or Polar bear or brown bear and get that effect that will cleanse the soul". ~ Fred Bear
The Survival Podcast
"If some of our teenage thrill seeker really want to go out and get a thrill. Let them go up into the north west and let them tangle with a Grizzly bear or Polar bear or brown bear and get that effect that will cleanse the soul". ~ Fred Bear
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Personally when she said, I don't know, I would simply of ask, "honey would you like to know, would you like to be able to answer that question"?Ya, I'll try that, we're supposed to have a sit down this weekend and discuss things.
It is amazing what asking a person can do vs. telling a person something. Because when she says, yes, you simply say well, can we try to find that together. Hell, lets face it guys, Dr. Phil is crap compared to a good salesman,
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This latest show hit me like a ton of bricks. Huge thank you's to Jack and to CdnGuy.
I wanted to let my wife listen to it but damn it all if my vision of liberty doesn't sound a lot like you guys and I had to talk to my wife about not chasing what others say is your dream but what you think it is. I didn't want to appear hypocritical (but I'm absolutely not)! So to avoid the emotional stuff about how me not being happy with how things are going turning into "you don't love me" I wrote a long direct letter to my wife today and I think it hit home.
I might not be going to live at my BOL but my wife finally agrees, we aren't staying here in the burbs. I've sent her to school twice now to chase her dream. Now its my turn.
J
I wanted to let my wife listen to it but damn it all if my vision of liberty doesn't sound a lot like you guys and I had to talk to my wife about not chasing what others say is your dream but what you think it is. I didn't want to appear hypocritical (but I'm absolutely not)! So to avoid the emotional stuff about how me not being happy with how things are going turning into "you don't love me" I wrote a long direct letter to my wife today and I think it hit home.
I might not be going to live at my BOL but my wife finally agrees, we aren't staying here in the burbs. I've sent her to school twice now to chase her dream. Now its my turn.
J
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He leaned on his shovel, cocked his winter hat up a bit so he could look right at me. With a serious face but soft eyes he said, "My wife is very ill and has been for a long time. If something should happen, I want the ambulance and medics to be able to get to her as quickly and safely as possible. I love her and I don't want to lose her because I didn't shovel the walk."That was a great story! And thanks for sharing your plan and where you are now with the community. I love this podcast, forum, and mostly, all of the great people here! (lol almost left out that last comma, what a difference a comma makes)
Lifetime MSB member before it was cool...
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All fruitless meaningless exercises in this age of apathy and control. I realized that what I do believe in is taking proactive steps to make my world a better place for everyone by making choices in my own personal life."
- Comrade Tweek
"I don't believe in organizing, I don't believe in the supposed revolution, I don't believe in politics, I don't believe in protesting, I don't believe in educating the masses, etc.
All fruitless meaningless exercises in this age of apathy and control. I realized that what I do believe in is taking proactive steps to make my world a better place for everyone by making choices in my own personal life."
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My goal in ten years is to generate at least half of my energy needs, 80% of my food, and be 100% mortgage free.Good for you! Working in our vocation is primarily for the service of our neighbors, not just our own wants/needs. If more American's understood this we wouldn't be in the mess we're in. And the prepping we do is (or perhaps should be) for those we love, so we can make sure (1) they're taken care of and (2) they aren't saddled with taking care of us.
I find work enjoyable, when not accompanied with financial hardships. I could see working until my final day on earth, because I want to work.
I, too, hope to be doing productive work up to the day I die. But I also hope to be a cheerful worker, doing something I like and see value in, and doing it in large part for others, not just myself. I can't help but wonder if the reason so many of us struggle with our jobs is that many of them (mine included) seem to lack obvious, indisputable value in the grand scheme of things. Growing food, producing energy, homesteading, teaching our kids skills - it is very easy to recognize the value in these things. Hence, people on this forum are attracted to and passionate about these things. Most people would be if they weren't so caught up in getting that Benz or 3,500 sq foot McMansion.
I can't help but wonder if the reason so many of us struggle with our jobs is that many of them (mine included) seem to lack obvious, indisputable value in the grand scheme of things. Growing food, producing energy, homesteading, teaching our kids skills - it is very easy to recognize the value in these things. Hence, people on this forum are attracted to and passionate about these things. Most people would be if they weren't so caught up in getting that Benz or 3,500 sq foot McMansion.And that hits the nail on the head! We all will work until the day we die. we will be doing stuff of some sort, which is what work is, strictly speaking. But do we work to produce something lacking that 'obvious, indisputable value', or do we work to provide life and love for the people around us? That's the choice.
I definitely agree that is exactly why so many people struggle with their jobs. People who value those things you mention, find it hard to do those things when they're putting in 40 or more hours a week at a job. People who value the Benz and such may well get more satisfaction out of their jobs, if they are successful at their jobs, than those of us who just want to have a home and a family, and want to make that our job. Some people get lucky and can do some of each. I think I'm one of those lucky ones.
I actually really enjoy my job! I'm lucky that way. I think it's because the knowledge that I'm gaining is directly related to the homesteading and energy production. I work in oil and gas, which oddly enough uses more solar energy than you would believe, and my employers and co-workers are all either hunters, farmers, cattlemen or at least they were at one time. So I learn SO much from them! Nonetheless, I will be taking that knowledge to the homestead to make that knowledge work for my family and our dreams.
Great post RationalHusker!
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@CdnGuy,
I'm lucky in that I enjoy my day to day tasks/responsibilities of my current "work-a-day" job, too. And I work in water resources, so I've picked up a thing or two that apply to homesteading, especially gardening. Sizing pumps, understanding how water moves in the atmosphere and once it reaches the earth's surface, and the nutrient cycle, just to name a few things. However, it wasn't until I started listening to TSP and other homesteading related blogs that I was able to see how to use some of that info in a more meaningful way than just cranking out some document required by the government. My biggest frustrations with my current job are that soil and water quality problems are nearly always viewed (by those in the "system") as something only more government and more legislation can cure. At the same time, those that tend to be on the opposite end of the spectrum poo-poo the validity of any potential concern and are quick to cite private property rights as an excuse to unknowingly violate the property rights of others. Long story, but I'm right in the middle of that tug-of-war...yuck!
In the spirit of your original post in this thread, I'm going to lay out my goals and aspirations below. Short term, my wife and I are selling our current home - a very typical suburban 3 bed/2bath on a 0.23 acre lot. Not in the suburbs, but in a small town near a city. Unfortunately, though, the area behaves more like a suburb than small town. We're doing the best we can to make our property produce for us, but we know long term we can do much better somewhere else, so we're getting out. Our area has not be hurt terribly by the housing market, but we will most likely walk away with $6,000-$8,000 less money than we put down originally. But more importantly, we'll walk away completely debt free with money in the bank.
The next 3 years I'll be working towards a PhD, co-majoring in civil and agricultural engineering. I was very hesitant to do this, thinking that I'd rather be prepping and working towards getting that homestead. The real downside is that we can't "know" where we'll live the next 10+ years, so it delays some of our homesteading goals. But I have a great arrangement with my advisor and current employer, and financially this move is a no-brainer. Best of all, I believe it will provide me the opportunity to do more of what I want, and less of what I don't. The 5-year goal is to have obtained a adjunct faculty (strictly teaching) position and do some research and/or consulting on the side, or obtain a strictly non tenure-track research position. Either arrangement will allow me to work 20-30 hours a week, and hopefully all of that time will be spent evaluating sustainable urban and agricultural practices and their impact/benefit to soil and water and/or teaching water-related courses to future engineers/scientists.
At that point, we'll ramp up our homestead productivity immensely. In 10 years, the goal is to be growing 75% of our own food and generating 75% of our own energy. We also hope to be "growing for profit" within 10 years as well. Most likely veggies and/or fruits for selling at roadside stands, farmers markets, or a CSA. We will remain debt free once our current place is sold, with the exception that we will allow for 10-15 years worth of mortgage debt to acquire the new homestead. Fifteen years from today, I'll be nearly 50 years old, will own a productive homestead (free and clear) that generates food, energy, and some income. And I'll be in position to continue working 20 hours a week doing work I enjoy OR quit working outside the homestead completely and focus on our food growing (and possibly other microbusiness) full time. Hate to end on negatives (or should I say challenges), but I just hope that tape and string holds this economy together long enough to get out of our current home in decent shape. But even if it doesn't, there will be opportunities created, and it might in fact speed up our schedule and be a good thing. It's a lost easier to take a risk and put yourself out there if you loose a job or the economy goes belly up and you have no choice in the matter.
Thanks for starting this thread and for updating your progress.
--RH
I'm lucky in that I enjoy my day to day tasks/responsibilities of my current "work-a-day" job, too. And I work in water resources, so I've picked up a thing or two that apply to homesteading, especially gardening. Sizing pumps, understanding how water moves in the atmosphere and once it reaches the earth's surface, and the nutrient cycle, just to name a few things. However, it wasn't until I started listening to TSP and other homesteading related blogs that I was able to see how to use some of that info in a more meaningful way than just cranking out some document required by the government. My biggest frustrations with my current job are that soil and water quality problems are nearly always viewed (by those in the "system") as something only more government and more legislation can cure. At the same time, those that tend to be on the opposite end of the spectrum poo-poo the validity of any potential concern and are quick to cite private property rights as an excuse to unknowingly violate the property rights of others. Long story, but I'm right in the middle of that tug-of-war...yuck!
In the spirit of your original post in this thread, I'm going to lay out my goals and aspirations below. Short term, my wife and I are selling our current home - a very typical suburban 3 bed/2bath on a 0.23 acre lot. Not in the suburbs, but in a small town near a city. Unfortunately, though, the area behaves more like a suburb than small town. We're doing the best we can to make our property produce for us, but we know long term we can do much better somewhere else, so we're getting out. Our area has not be hurt terribly by the housing market, but we will most likely walk away with $6,000-$8,000 less money than we put down originally. But more importantly, we'll walk away completely debt free with money in the bank.
The next 3 years I'll be working towards a PhD, co-majoring in civil and agricultural engineering. I was very hesitant to do this, thinking that I'd rather be prepping and working towards getting that homestead. The real downside is that we can't "know" where we'll live the next 10+ years, so it delays some of our homesteading goals. But I have a great arrangement with my advisor and current employer, and financially this move is a no-brainer. Best of all, I believe it will provide me the opportunity to do more of what I want, and less of what I don't. The 5-year goal is to have obtained a adjunct faculty (strictly teaching) position and do some research and/or consulting on the side, or obtain a strictly non tenure-track research position. Either arrangement will allow me to work 20-30 hours a week, and hopefully all of that time will be spent evaluating sustainable urban and agricultural practices and their impact/benefit to soil and water and/or teaching water-related courses to future engineers/scientists.
At that point, we'll ramp up our homestead productivity immensely. In 10 years, the goal is to be growing 75% of our own food and generating 75% of our own energy. We also hope to be "growing for profit" within 10 years as well. Most likely veggies and/or fruits for selling at roadside stands, farmers markets, or a CSA. We will remain debt free once our current place is sold, with the exception that we will allow for 10-15 years worth of mortgage debt to acquire the new homestead. Fifteen years from today, I'll be nearly 50 years old, will own a productive homestead (free and clear) that generates food, energy, and some income. And I'll be in position to continue working 20 hours a week doing work I enjoy OR quit working outside the homestead completely and focus on our food growing (and possibly other microbusiness) full time. Hate to end on negatives (or should I say challenges), but I just hope that tape and string holds this economy together long enough to get out of our current home in decent shape. But even if it doesn't, there will be opportunities created, and it might in fact speed up our schedule and be a good thing. It's a lost easier to take a risk and put yourself out there if you loose a job or the economy goes belly up and you have no choice in the matter.
Thanks for starting this thread and for updating your progress.
--RH
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I bought a tract of farm land and am building a commercial ranching business as a means of paying for it. My hope is to have it paid off and be able to live off the income by the time I'm 55 (5 years to go). I'm doing everything as natural as possible to cut my expenses as much as possible. I should be able to make about 30K a year with my living expenses such as house, water, electricity, taxes etc. paid by the business. That will leave me living on a very comfortable retirement. I have no debt other than land and operating capital so my expenses are low. I plan to grow most of my own food including meat and eggs. I could even get a milking cow, but that is more work than I want (milking 3 times a day just isn't my idea of fun). Mostly I'll buy exotics like oranges and bananas that I can't grow in Northern SD. I can also buy dirt cheap wheat and corn from my neighbors who farm. If I can buy enough land over the years, I can rent it out to others when I get too old to do the work myself and still live reasonably. The work isn't that hard so that will be a while.
If I had known I couldn't do that, I wouldn't have done it.
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Preparedness is going to have to be my retirement plan. I was pretty, no, VERY well off prior to my panicking in the stock market of 2008. I attacked the situation by withdrawing ALL my IRAs, paying off my 127 acre farm, buying tangibles etc, and almost losing it all to the IRS because I wasn't 55 and a half. Ten percent penalties on top of taxes on that much money is huge. And when I didn't pay it to try to get the IRS to reduce penalties, I ended up owing thousands more. It took two and a half years to get someone to lease my house with an option to purchase, and I am very lucky to have found them! That was the money I needed to build a house on the farm, and it all went to BOA. So now I am in an RV building a tiny,tiny little house, and hoping it is finished before inflation what little I have left. My husband has not had steady work in over three years, and I haven't been in the job market for over twenty years.
I have everything my husband and I need...productive land, a huge garden, privacy, well and septic, storage garage, the RV for shelter, alot of supplies, a great amount of storage food, pond, prolific deer, 18 chickens, a greenhouse, tractor, ammunition and such...and NO DEBT, the only thing that may save me. We must develop some source of independent income though, because taxes and insurance still must be paid! I'm really very blessed, but I can't help being mad at myself that I could have made it all back in the stock market if I had just not panicked and sealed my future.
I have everything my husband and I need...productive land, a huge garden, privacy, well and septic, storage garage, the RV for shelter, alot of supplies, a great amount of storage food, pond, prolific deer, 18 chickens, a greenhouse, tractor, ammunition and such...and NO DEBT, the only thing that may save me. We must develop some source of independent income though, because taxes and insurance still must be paid! I'm really very blessed, but I can't help being mad at myself that I could have made it all back in the stock market if I had just not panicked and sealed my future.
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I do not know if my way can be applied to the USA but i invested a lot of "spare" money into agricultural land that i do not work but rent out, before i invested in the homestead.
I think that agricultural land is a commodity that will go up in price as it "can not be printed" and the rising price of energy makes farm land not only interesting for planting food or feed, but also for harvesting energy.
I rent it out on a year to year basis and only to responsible farmers that look after it which get discount prices .. there will always be the "i pay more" farmer that will destroy the land by planting the same crop for 10 years, i do not want that and can afford to make less than possible.
I do not owe much land to rent but after all taxes it pays my bill for central heating and my electricity bill and some other things or short: 3 months income i can invest in something else with the option to use the land myself in case TSHTF or it seems profitable enough.
Sure, invested into the stock market in the right time i could have made more return on investment, but i consider farm land still way too cheap, it is a long term investment without 3rd party risks, somehow just like precious metals.
As it's really a low ROI thing it also means that i am debt free, nobody will finance buying farmland because of this so prices are considerable cheap compared to prices for home or commercial properties that went up here +10% in the last year (which could be called crack up boom)
As i think that energy is going to be more and more expensive my retirement plan is to plant energy harvesting crops on that land before entering retirement in 30 years if i can make more money at that time in the furure compared to rent.
Today i think of elephant grass which will provide 15 metric tons per ha (AP. 2,2 acres) every year with minimal care once established which means the annual production costs for a 20 year used culture are AP. 40 euros per ton per year (interest included)
So one hectar will cost ap 600 euros per year while producing ap. 66.000 kWh of energy which equals ap. 6500 litres or ap. 1700 gallons of heating oil which are ap. 5900 euros today.
Sure, miscanthus is sold cheaper than heating oil (litre heating oil is ap. 90 eurocent today) but over the last years i noticed that the price per kWh for any form of energy is slowly creeping into a more and more narrow price range with electricity on top, oil and gas in the middle and biomass on the bottom.
The work of harvesting the fields can be outsourced (is included in the cost per ton price) and i have enough space to keep harvested grass in storage to not have to sell it at any price at harvest time.
So this is my basic retirement plan that is centered on avoiding 3rd party risks.
Own land and rent it out or produce energy on it myself while outsourcing work.
My grandfather made a load of money by renting parts of the land to the "village people" for gardens which is another option in a "gloomy" future.
This plan does not include my retirement funds and state pension from my job (i have written off that money in my mind anyway) or some PM i aquired over time nor does it include the preparedness stuff like garden, trees and trying to live frugal.
I think that agricultural land is a commodity that will go up in price as it "can not be printed" and the rising price of energy makes farm land not only interesting for planting food or feed, but also for harvesting energy.
I rent it out on a year to year basis and only to responsible farmers that look after it which get discount prices .. there will always be the "i pay more" farmer that will destroy the land by planting the same crop for 10 years, i do not want that and can afford to make less than possible.
I do not owe much land to rent but after all taxes it pays my bill for central heating and my electricity bill and some other things or short: 3 months income i can invest in something else with the option to use the land myself in case TSHTF or it seems profitable enough.
Sure, invested into the stock market in the right time i could have made more return on investment, but i consider farm land still way too cheap, it is a long term investment without 3rd party risks, somehow just like precious metals.
As it's really a low ROI thing it also means that i am debt free, nobody will finance buying farmland because of this so prices are considerable cheap compared to prices for home or commercial properties that went up here +10% in the last year (which could be called crack up boom)
As i think that energy is going to be more and more expensive my retirement plan is to plant energy harvesting crops on that land before entering retirement in 30 years if i can make more money at that time in the furure compared to rent.
Today i think of elephant grass which will provide 15 metric tons per ha (AP. 2,2 acres) every year with minimal care once established which means the annual production costs for a 20 year used culture are AP. 40 euros per ton per year (interest included)
So one hectar will cost ap 600 euros per year while producing ap. 66.000 kWh of energy which equals ap. 6500 litres or ap. 1700 gallons of heating oil which are ap. 5900 euros today.
Sure, miscanthus is sold cheaper than heating oil (litre heating oil is ap. 90 eurocent today) but over the last years i noticed that the price per kWh for any form of energy is slowly creeping into a more and more narrow price range with electricity on top, oil and gas in the middle and biomass on the bottom.
The work of harvesting the fields can be outsourced (is included in the cost per ton price) and i have enough space to keep harvested grass in storage to not have to sell it at any price at harvest time.
So this is my basic retirement plan that is centered on avoiding 3rd party risks.
Own land and rent it out or produce energy on it myself while outsourcing work.
My grandfather made a load of money by renting parts of the land to the "village people" for gardens which is another option in a "gloomy" future.
This plan does not include my retirement funds and state pension from my job (i have written off that money in my mind anyway) or some PM i aquired over time nor does it include the preparedness stuff like garden, trees and trying to live frugal.
- Just a Desperado Under The Eaves
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I do not know if my way can be applied to the USA but i invested a lot of "spare" money into agricultural land that i do not work but rent out, before i invested in the homestead.It will work and I am looking into it myself. The one challenge is that getting a loan on raw land in the US is a LOT harder then buying a home in suburban hell. I am pretty big on at least 20% down on any purchase of real estate anyway. Property is of course the one place I am okay with debt, the key is if you are renting it to make sure you could easily cover the payments with 12 months of vacancy if you had to.
I think that agricultural land is a commodity that will go up in price as it "can not be printed" and the rising price of energy makes farm land not only interesting for planting food or feed, but also for harvesting energy.
I rent it out on a year to year basis and only to responsible farmers that look after it which get discount prices .. there will always be the "i pay more" farmer that will destroy the land by planting the same crop for 10 years, i do not want that and can afford to make less than possible.
My hope is to get a few parcels in my area of Arkansas down south of me a bit where there is better soil. Rent to farmers like you do and reserve say an arcre to ever ten to practice food forest permaculture on. I figure it won't take long until my tennents go, hey how the hell do yo do all this with no irrigation or fertilizer.
Four birds with one stone,
1. Acquire an asset with OPM (other people's money)
2. Produce cashflow
3. Build a long term income producing asset (food forests)
4. Spread the techniques and mentality of permaculture
Bill Mollison has taught many people to become wealthy with Permaculture, I just wish he had done it for himself.
Jack Spirko
The Survival Podcast
"If some of our teenage thrill seeker really want to go out and get a thrill. Let them go up into the north west and let them tangle with a Grizzly bear or Polar bear or brown bear and get that effect that will cleanse the soul". ~ Fred Bear
The Survival Podcast
"If some of our teenage thrill seeker really want to go out and get a thrill. Let them go up into the north west and let them tangle with a Grizzly bear or Polar bear or brown bear and get that effect that will cleanse the soul". ~ Fred Bear
- Just a Desperado Under The Eaves
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Oh well five birds with one stone.
5. Provide multiple tracts of recreational/hunting land for Jack and his buddies.
5. Provide multiple tracts of recreational/hunting land for Jack and his buddies.
Jack Spirko
The Survival Podcast
"If some of our teenage thrill seeker really want to go out and get a thrill. Let them go up into the north west and let them tangle with a Grizzly bear or Polar bear or brown bear and get that effect that will cleanse the soul". ~ Fred Bear
The Survival Podcast
"If some of our teenage thrill seeker really want to go out and get a thrill. Let them go up into the north west and let them tangle with a Grizzly bear or Polar bear or brown bear and get that effect that will cleanse the soul". ~ Fred Bear
- Prepper
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Four birds with one stone,Hi, may i throw in some of my ideas in addition ?
1. Acquire an asset with OPM (other people's money)
2. Produce cashflow
3. Build a long term income producing asset (food forests)
4. Spread the techniques and mentality of permaculture
Bill Mollison has taught many people to become wealthy with Permaculture, I just wish he had done it for himself.
Step one is the one i would be afraid of as basically it is "leverage" which i think under the current twitchings of the financial system is not that great of an idea.
At least here where you can not "walk away" from a mortgage, you may lose everything .. but not your debt.
(I should specify "here" which is austria)
Step 2 is what i have in mind.
Step 3 in my opinion also carries a risk which is efficiency.
A modern miscanthus harvester can harvest all my acreage in under one day, i do not even have to be there or can have two broken legs and it is about retirement.
A time where i do not want to work more, i want to literally harvest the fruits of my life (if, and when and ..)
A food forest at least requires a lot of work at the time of harvest. I know a bit about that as i literally bombed my own forest with seed bombs (mostly ranking stuff like beans) and very likely it won't keep up with the amount of food modern agriculture can produce so if there is no niche for high quality food the calculation could be tight.
Even worse, in a "bad" economy where money (or whatever is money at that time) is tight consumers do not care about quality .. they care about availability (local producer = you win) or price per pound (= you lose against giant agrocorp or even imports)
Step 4:
Sorry that i personally think it is overhyped.
I have visited our local pioneer called Sepp Holzer and while what he has achieved is impressive there are things he can not deny.
First, he used additional biomass ... which was basically mud from wastewater treatment and got money for it.
I would not like that stuff on my property, not even on fields not used for any eatable harvest.
Second, i think he makes more money with his visitors and books than he can make with the fruit and meat produced. So he wins financially because he is "the first" who came up with the idea and can market additional services and not only the produce.
His info is good and i use some of his techniques (my own way) and they do work for a homestead, but i can not imagine scaling it up into an income generating way (enough to pay the loan of step 1) without really cheap slaves actually doing all the manual work as force multipliers.
I should note, in tshtf very likely there will be enough people that will work for a meal and a roof over their head so i would not deny that it can be done.
Food forest for own consumption and maybe some local selling or bartering can work fine, there could be troubles when the "zombie mutant bikers" roam the land (from the harvest being stolen to worse problems like running into a trap..) as it may not be a reliable source of self grown food and as stated above i consider it hard to generate enough income to pay back other´s peoples money.
Else, if it is good soil and cheap i would grab what i can (they can´t print gold, silver, oil and fields)
- Prepper
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Buying farm land to rent out is not a bad option if you don't want to farm it yourself. I like cattle, so I don't mind doing it and can make more money that way. Out in SD, you don't need to worry about not having a tenant. I advertized renting my land for one year and got responses from hundreds of miles away. I try to keep a year's land payment on hand just in case, but more because I could have a bad year.
If I had known I couldn't do that, I wouldn't have done it.
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When we heard this on the podcast, it was like a light went on. It was this idea that completely shifted me and hubby's lives, and the thing that brought hubby into my prepping fold. We have completely rethought retirement (to the complete consternation of my mother) and now our retirement is our homestead. This single idea broke us out of the societal rut, and we now really have something to live for. We have taken our frustrations and hopelessness and channeled them into our homestead. Every day we take a step and do something that brings us closer to our goals, and we have started teaching our children this lifestyle. We are making space for them to live on our land with us, and plan to "retire" in 10 years...I look forward to shifting my work to areas I enjoy more, and being more of service. It just makes so much sense. Thanks so much for this perspective, and to Jack for mentioning it on the podcast. It completely changed our lives for the better!
The retirement angle is what really motivates me, but regrettably, my wife is very resistant. I've located a great place only 60 miles from Dallas (where I work) and only 15 minutes from a large regional hospital (my wife is a surgical first assist). We are both lifetime urbanites and the idea of eventually moving out to a rural area can be very frightening. I think to, when you start to make these sorts of plans it has a feeling of "finality" to it that is also scary - it acknowledges that you are getting older and moving into a new phase of life that is on the downward trajectory (if you know what I mean). Nevertheless, I am convinced that this is the lowest risk retirement strategy that exists. Over time, my wife will come to see it, but for now, I feel like I have to take the lead and steer this ship (as it were) toward those smoother seas.
You don't need to be a weatherman to know which way the wind blows. ~ Bob Dylan
- Fledgling Prepper
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I am turning 37 and I can say that I am retired from the rate-race, but working when I want to. We grow most of our own food and are now moving towards food forest and perennial gardens. We bought 3 acres of land, built a simple home, built gardens, paid for a car and a truck and quit being a wage slave.. It something I think anyone can do if they put their minds to it. The land and house cost $12,000 and perhaps another $7,000 in infrastructure like a well. I don't even care that the house is not professionally built; its warm,dry and safe. Our mass-heater uses less than 1/3 cord of wood per year and a dip in the duck pond keeps us cool in the summer. Camping out on family land for three years and saving EVERY penny was way simpler than spending 20 years paying a mortgage. I think I would even squat on unused land it I had to.
I cant even begin to express how much better this stress free life style is over what I once lived. I have done away with everything that does not add value to my life including the TV. It amazing how little we really need vs what society around us tells us we need.
Our grocery budget is $40 a month for sugar soap ect; family of 4.
We use $70 in electricity and that will be going away as we move to using producer gas for hot water, cooking, drying ect..
Our auto insurance is $60 a month.
Home school books $20/month
Savings $100
Clothing $30
Animal feed $60
Gas $50
Cell Phone $50
Making $500 a month is not to hard. I do have a trade and it takes 10 hours a month to make ends meet. I find there is always something out there to do. Worst month ever I had to paint a fence and clean a yard. It took a whole week to pay the bills that month, lol. Its funny, but if I made what is considered "poverty" I would have no idea what to do with that much money.. Push come to shove we could get the $18/month car insurance for rarely driven cars, stay home, turn off the power, and live on what we have saved or what google adsense pays us for the rest of our lives. Going to work is more like a social call now; something I almost feel guilty getting paid for. Its no longer a must do part of life.
There are just some things worth much more than society and modern life offers us; like peace of mind with contentment and time to listen to the frogs sing their evening song, getting out of bed when I want and going to bed when its dark. Everyhing I do has meaning and is important to me. It makes life a total joy and there is no way to put a price on that!!
So I said all that to say, dont give up this prepairdness as a retirement idea, because it is way MORE than its cracked up to be and SO VERY worth the effort to get there! No one else I know will retire for another 30 years which is almost their entire life span OVER again!
I cant even begin to express how much better this stress free life style is over what I once lived. I have done away with everything that does not add value to my life including the TV. It amazing how little we really need vs what society around us tells us we need.
Our grocery budget is $40 a month for sugar soap ect; family of 4.
We use $70 in electricity and that will be going away as we move to using producer gas for hot water, cooking, drying ect..
Our auto insurance is $60 a month.
Home school books $20/month
Savings $100
Clothing $30
Animal feed $60
Gas $50
Cell Phone $50
Making $500 a month is not to hard. I do have a trade and it takes 10 hours a month to make ends meet. I find there is always something out there to do. Worst month ever I had to paint a fence and clean a yard. It took a whole week to pay the bills that month, lol. Its funny, but if I made what is considered "poverty" I would have no idea what to do with that much money.. Push come to shove we could get the $18/month car insurance for rarely driven cars, stay home, turn off the power, and live on what we have saved or what google adsense pays us for the rest of our lives. Going to work is more like a social call now; something I almost feel guilty getting paid for. Its no longer a must do part of life.
There are just some things worth much more than society and modern life offers us; like peace of mind with contentment and time to listen to the frogs sing their evening song, getting out of bed when I want and going to bed when its dark. Everyhing I do has meaning and is important to me. It makes life a total joy and there is no way to put a price on that!!
So I said all that to say, dont give up this prepairdness as a retirement idea, because it is way MORE than its cracked up to be and SO VERY worth the effort to get there! No one else I know will retire for another 30 years which is almost their entire life span OVER again!
- Survivalist Mentor
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- Expanding my skill set: studying to be a nurse
o-so-u-812,
What are you doing for health insurance? I have it through work, and still have to pay over $200 a month in premiums for a family. This will be doubling in January as I drop to part time to start nursing school. We are a 1 income family with a baby at home. Our prepper and frugal lifestyle is making this possible. We will have 2 lean years and then the rest will be gravy!
What are you doing for health insurance? I have it through work, and still have to pay over $200 a month in premiums for a family. This will be doubling in January as I drop to part time to start nursing school. We are a 1 income family with a baby at home. Our prepper and frugal lifestyle is making this possible. We will have 2 lean years and then the rest will be gravy!
NATE
"This is the Law of the Yukon, that only the Strong shall thrive;
That surely the Weak shall perish, and only the Fit survive." Robert Service
"This is the Law of the Yukon, that only the Strong shall thrive;
That surely the Weak shall perish, and only the Fit survive." Robert Service
- Prepper
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- Love all things homesteading
That's my plan man. My 401 K sucks. I live here on 56 acres that will be paid off in about 7 years. I plan to shorten that time. I am 53 years old and have a small homestead. Even though I have paid into social nonsecurity since I was 17 - don't expect any back GRRRHH! I can live off this land. Right now we make a little extra cash selling grass fed pigs. But we have a long way to go. I feel so strongly in my heart I need to pay this off and get totally self sufficient!
- Resident Master Mudder
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I can't really say that preparedness is our entire retirement plan, but my husband checked out of the rat race last spring way early (at age 51) since we moved toward that goal. He took the earliest possible retirement from his job, so we have a monthly retirement check coming in and good healthcare insurance. The thing we realized before we took the plunge was that we couldn't possibly make ends meet on that retirement check if we had a mortgage to pay.
When we decided on this course of action, about 3-4 years ago, we were already 100% debt free (except for the mortgage), so no bills looming. The main thing we had to do was to sell the big mortgage home and then for the past couple of years to save every penny so we could afford to build the house from our savings. We've discovered we couldn't afford to pay the labor costs for a lot of the work and stay within the budget, so... we are building our own home on 5 acres and living in our travel trailer while that is continuing. We are documenting the progress on our blog -- life is good.
One of the first things we did last year when we started building was to buy some mature pecan trees and have them transplanted here. We are hopeful that they will begin to bear much sooner than younger trees would have. Pecans are a huge cash crop around here, so they should start to pay for themselves soon. We're also hoping to have a big garden and orchard and some livestock (at least chickens) once the biggest part of the work is done...
When we decided on this course of action, about 3-4 years ago, we were already 100% debt free (except for the mortgage), so no bills looming. The main thing we had to do was to sell the big mortgage home and then for the past couple of years to save every penny so we could afford to build the house from our savings. We've discovered we couldn't afford to pay the labor costs for a lot of the work and stay within the budget, so... we are building our own home on 5 acres and living in our travel trailer while that is continuing. We are documenting the progress on our blog -- life is good.
One of the first things we did last year when we started building was to buy some mature pecan trees and have them transplanted here. We are hopeful that they will begin to bear much sooner than younger trees would have. Pecans are a huge cash crop around here, so they should start to pay for themselves soon. We're also hoping to have a big garden and orchard and some livestock (at least chickens) once the biggest part of the work is done...
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CDN Guy- You've put my thoughts into words and they sound mighty fine.
- Fledgling Prepper
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I'm glad I stumbled into this tread. My wife and I both have corporate jobs and were caught up in the American way ie car payments, mortgage, cell phone bills, etc. About a year ago I started getting concerned with the world so I started doing research on living off the land. First I got caught up in packaged foods then I realized it would be healthier to grow my own food. We have chickens,and rabbits and I'm growing a garden. I got a old 70's heavy duty tiller for free and replaced the engine for $100. I built the chicken coops and rabbit cages myself. Bees are next on my list. I've always been a mechanic. Started working on cars, then heavy equipment, and now jet air planes so I can repair just about anything. Bartering, I think is the future.
The wife and I have talked about selling off most of the things we own and moving on our 5 acres, Me quitting my job and selling organic foods, and doing side work to make a few dollars. Her job seems more stable. So basically I would still be the bread winner(kinda). lol
I don't see how we can ever retire working regular jobs. My goal is to become 100% self reliant. We'll still have taxes and a mortgage for a while but I think it's possible to cut our bills in half and get one hand out of my pocket.
The wife and I have talked about selling off most of the things we own and moving on our 5 acres, Me quitting my job and selling organic foods, and doing side work to make a few dollars. Her job seems more stable. So basically I would still be the bread winner(kinda). lol
I don't see how we can ever retire working regular jobs. My goal is to become 100% self reliant. We'll still have taxes and a mortgage for a while but I think it's possible to cut our bills in half and get one hand out of my pocket.
- Prepper
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This has been my plan for the past couple of years and we are slowly working toward paying off all debt. Just the house remains now.... Aside from having no confidence that my promised retirement income will be there when I retire, it would give me great peace of mind to be in a financial position to walk away from my job when the day comes that I am asked to do something I am not comfortable with..... with things as they are, that day may not be far away.
The good news is that we built our "retirement" home a couple of years ago and are working on surrounding it with a food forest. The bad news is that my job requires us to move around often and in a few months we are relocating to South America and must leave our homestead for an extended period of time. I hate having to leave for so long but know it will pay off in the end and actually hope to be fairly close to paying off the house by the time we return! It's a bit ambitious, but I intend to try!
We are still trying to decide what to do with the house while we are away? I'd like to rent it for a small amount, and find someone who can be trusted implicitly to keep an eye on things. The house is off-the-grid, not easy to find and not easy to get to, so it would have to be someone who doesn't mind a really rough road and/or doesn't need to leave everyday for work. My husband is reluctant to have anyone living there, especially since we plan to come home as often as possible on vacation, but I think we need someone to maintain and equalize the batteries, run the generator, feed the cats, etc..... Not to mention, the tax benefits of having it as a rental would be substantial and get us closer to the overall goal of paying it off. We still have a few months to figure it out, but if anyone has any thoughts on the pros/cons of this scenario I'd love to hear them.
The good news is that we built our "retirement" home a couple of years ago and are working on surrounding it with a food forest. The bad news is that my job requires us to move around often and in a few months we are relocating to South America and must leave our homestead for an extended period of time. I hate having to leave for so long but know it will pay off in the end and actually hope to be fairly close to paying off the house by the time we return! It's a bit ambitious, but I intend to try!
We are still trying to decide what to do with the house while we are away? I'd like to rent it for a small amount, and find someone who can be trusted implicitly to keep an eye on things. The house is off-the-grid, not easy to find and not easy to get to, so it would have to be someone who doesn't mind a really rough road and/or doesn't need to leave everyday for work. My husband is reluctant to have anyone living there, especially since we plan to come home as often as possible on vacation, but I think we need someone to maintain and equalize the batteries, run the generator, feed the cats, etc..... Not to mention, the tax benefits of having it as a rental would be substantial and get us closer to the overall goal of paying it off. We still have a few months to figure it out, but if anyone has any thoughts on the pros/cons of this scenario I'd love to hear them.
- Resident Master Mudder
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I think it would be way better to have someone you trust living there. Unoccupied homes (no matter how remote) are big targets for theft and vandalism. It would probably even be worth having someone live there as a "house-sitter", rather than leaving it unoccupied. Just my opinion.
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- New TSP Forum member
What a great thread. It really crystallizes what I've been thinking. I'm so glad I read it. These stories are so inspiring. I think I'll download and listen to the episode tonight after I put our children to bed.
My wife and I felt so secure in our old 'rat race' style lives. We both had good jobs, good savings, what we thought was reasonable debt... The best laid plan of mice and men. We decided to have a child and had twins instead-surprise number 1. We went ahead with the plan of me quitting to be a SAHD, and then the minor disasters started. Fast forward to today and debt has ballooned, retirement accounts depleted to pay unforeseen medical expenses, yadda yadda yadda.
Luckily, we always wanted to homestead. We didn't know that's what you called it, and we sorta realized we had a bit of a survival mindset without realizing it either. We have a beautiful home on about 5 acres, mostly forested. I've been slowly clearing trees while taking care of my sons, and cutting expenses was part of the stay at home plan anyway... So we've been making progress on the homestead while already getting into that ubber debt reduction mode. We've been paying extra on the mortgage every year, and do bimonthly payments. That saved us from a complete wipeout. The value of the house plummeted when the market crashed, but has since climbed back up. We are in the process of refinancing and will use that equity to pay down a large chunk of the credit card and medical debt. The lower payment and interest rate will enable us to make greater payments on that debt each month and get the snowball rolling, and provide some breathing room each month. Plus well save about 10 grand over the current mortgage. Part of me hates to do it, because we are almost halfway through the current mortgage, but after the other debt is paid off, we will be able to triple or even quadruple what we send to the bank each month. And even if we didn't do that, it would be paid off anyway by the time my wife hits 52. But given the way we live now, I have no doubt we can accelerate that significantly with very little effort.
Once that debt is under control, we can bring in someone to clear all these stumps me and my chainsaw have created. I have a friend with a portable saw mill who will be milling all these logs into lumber for me. It's mostly cedar, but also hemlock and fir, and some big rock maple. He's doing it in exchange for the occasional child care I do for him and has wife. I'll have a great supply of cedar landscape timbers for raised beds and such, plus plenty of rough cut boards for outbuildings.
And my boys are starting pre-k this year... I should have mornings free to start seriously ramping up on the labor I can't safely do while watching them. Once I get real food production going, I can cut our expenses even more. We do lots of CSA, pick your own, and similar things now to cut the grocery bill, but it's still the biggest and most variable monthly expense after that unsecured debt. Continuing to get it down will not only accelerate us on our sustainability and preparedness goals, but also free up more money to get debt free that much quicker.
I feel like we're getting there, but maybe we have come at it backwards. Still, although our unsecured debt ballooned in the last 4 years, I feel like we have a plan, and my wife and I are united in our ultimate goal. We've talked very broadly about getting more preparred, becoming self sufficient since we don't trust and no longer have 'normal' retirement options. But like I said, this thread has really crystallized my thinking. I wish I had a better idea than refinancing/home equity, but after doing things like selling the car and truck in exchange for older model used vehicles, plus selling off lots of stuff around the house and cutting other expenses... This seems to be the best way to wipe out the vast majority of that debt. And once that debt is gone, we can really accelerate the rest of our homesteading and self sufficiency/survival plans.
We'll get there. I know we will. This thread has so inspired me, I think I'll sit down and write a long letter to my wife tonight (like the other poster) after listening to the podcast. I want to let her know that we are in this together, and we'll get out together. To spell out all the positive things we've done to get out of this mess, and how they are helping us move ahead. And spell out my dream for her to join me as a stay at home parent earlier than we thought. Earlier than we thought even before we got smacked down by Murphy. And how we will never be in that position again.
Thank you so much everyone. I wish I had found this podcast and forum five years ago. I would have done some stuff differently for sure. But I found it now, and with each new day I can put more of that knowledge to work for our family and our security. Thank you. Really, thank you.
My wife and I felt so secure in our old 'rat race' style lives. We both had good jobs, good savings, what we thought was reasonable debt... The best laid plan of mice and men. We decided to have a child and had twins instead-surprise number 1. We went ahead with the plan of me quitting to be a SAHD, and then the minor disasters started. Fast forward to today and debt has ballooned, retirement accounts depleted to pay unforeseen medical expenses, yadda yadda yadda.
Luckily, we always wanted to homestead. We didn't know that's what you called it, and we sorta realized we had a bit of a survival mindset without realizing it either. We have a beautiful home on about 5 acres, mostly forested. I've been slowly clearing trees while taking care of my sons, and cutting expenses was part of the stay at home plan anyway... So we've been making progress on the homestead while already getting into that ubber debt reduction mode. We've been paying extra on the mortgage every year, and do bimonthly payments. That saved us from a complete wipeout. The value of the house plummeted when the market crashed, but has since climbed back up. We are in the process of refinancing and will use that equity to pay down a large chunk of the credit card and medical debt. The lower payment and interest rate will enable us to make greater payments on that debt each month and get the snowball rolling, and provide some breathing room each month. Plus well save about 10 grand over the current mortgage. Part of me hates to do it, because we are almost halfway through the current mortgage, but after the other debt is paid off, we will be able to triple or even quadruple what we send to the bank each month. And even if we didn't do that, it would be paid off anyway by the time my wife hits 52. But given the way we live now, I have no doubt we can accelerate that significantly with very little effort.
Once that debt is under control, we can bring in someone to clear all these stumps me and my chainsaw have created. I have a friend with a portable saw mill who will be milling all these logs into lumber for me. It's mostly cedar, but also hemlock and fir, and some big rock maple. He's doing it in exchange for the occasional child care I do for him and has wife. I'll have a great supply of cedar landscape timbers for raised beds and such, plus plenty of rough cut boards for outbuildings.
And my boys are starting pre-k this year... I should have mornings free to start seriously ramping up on the labor I can't safely do while watching them. Once I get real food production going, I can cut our expenses even more. We do lots of CSA, pick your own, and similar things now to cut the grocery bill, but it's still the biggest and most variable monthly expense after that unsecured debt. Continuing to get it down will not only accelerate us on our sustainability and preparedness goals, but also free up more money to get debt free that much quicker.
I feel like we're getting there, but maybe we have come at it backwards. Still, although our unsecured debt ballooned in the last 4 years, I feel like we have a plan, and my wife and I are united in our ultimate goal. We've talked very broadly about getting more preparred, becoming self sufficient since we don't trust and no longer have 'normal' retirement options. But like I said, this thread has really crystallized my thinking. I wish I had a better idea than refinancing/home equity, but after doing things like selling the car and truck in exchange for older model used vehicles, plus selling off lots of stuff around the house and cutting other expenses... This seems to be the best way to wipe out the vast majority of that debt. And once that debt is gone, we can really accelerate the rest of our homesteading and self sufficiency/survival plans.
We'll get there. I know we will. This thread has so inspired me, I think I'll sit down and write a long letter to my wife tonight (like the other poster) after listening to the podcast. I want to let her know that we are in this together, and we'll get out together. To spell out all the positive things we've done to get out of this mess, and how they are helping us move ahead. And spell out my dream for her to join me as a stay at home parent earlier than we thought. Earlier than we thought even before we got smacked down by Murphy. And how we will never be in that position again.
Thank you so much everyone. I wish I had found this podcast and forum five years ago. I would have done some stuff differently for sure. But I found it now, and with each new day I can put more of that knowledge to work for our family and our security. Thank you. Really, thank you.